2012 Cruze ECO MT : Hi-end full audio system upgrade

[jstoner22]

Although the actual install will not be occurring for another few weeks, I decided to post this now as I begin to gather all the gear needed to complete the task.This will be a full system upgrade of the audio system in my 2012 Cruze, resulting in a 4-way active system.All of my crossover points are simply projections. There really is no way of knowing where they will end up until the install is complete.Obviously any input, suggestions, and questions are encouraged!To outline the system, I will being from the front back.


Head Unit
Pioneer 'DEX-P99RS'

Pioneer is a legend in the SQ game. This unit is on stage with the best audiophile head-units ever produced. The beauty of it is its 'all-in-one nature'. By having extensive internal Digital Sound Processing (DSP) capabilities, it eliminates the need for an external processor. This reduces the complexity of install, and number of components in the audio chain (less A/D conversions and connections etc).In addition it has top end CD playback capabilities, in addition to bypassing the DAC's in a connected IPOD. Providing lossless audio is put on the ipod in use, there is no cleaner source. All of the following gear will be run active off of this unit, utilizing its 31 L/R EQ, precise Time alignment, individual driver level adjustments, and internal crossovers.

The unit can be found here => DEX-P99RS - Reference-Quality CD Tuner with Digital DSP and USB Port with Digital Direct Signal Transmission | Pioneer of Canada - English

Front StageTweeters - Hertz Audio 'ML 28'
8000hz and above.

Hertz is an italian company owned by Elettromedia. They same company that produces Audison. I fell in love with these tweeters when I heard them. They suit my personal tastes perfectly. They are warm and laid back. Not much else to say here.







Mid Range - Hybrid Audio Technologies 'Legatia L3SE'
400hz - 8000hz

Hybrid Audio or H.A.T, is an american company that in recent years has dominated the SQ compeition scene. These are wide band mid range drivers. To look at, they are beautiful. The phase plugs and magnets are plated with rose copper. Functionally, they allow for my front stage crossover points to be moved out of the spectrum that the human voice lies. This will help with phasing issues occurring in these ranges. In addition, they allow for the front woofers and tweeters to perform optimally as they are not required to reproduce such a large chunk of audio frequencies. This is especially helpful with mid-bass.Info can be found here => Stage VI - Legatia SE - The Home of the World's Finest Loudspeakers, and World Championship Car Audio Speaker Systems.






Woofers - Hertz Audio 'ML 165'
63hz-400hz

These woofers are legends for there amazing mid-bass capabilities. In a project where I do not want to tear into the car for 8 or even 10 inch door woofers, these fit the application perfectly.

[jstoner22]

Sub Stage
Subwoofer - Image Dynamics 'IDMax 12'
30hz-63hz

Image Dynamics is another american company that has been lauded for their exceptional subs above all else over the last 15 years. From their IDQ series to their top end IDMax. The IDMax retains the SQ of the IDQ with a generous increase in SPL. It functions great anywhere from 200-1000 continuous watts.A pair of these in sealed enclosures will be run.Info can be found here => Car Speakers & Amplifiers | Ontario, CA






Tactile Transducer - Buttkicker Mini
20hz-160hz

If used CORRECTLY these are not simply a gimmick. A tactile transducer or 'bass shaker' can do absolute wonders in a SQ oriented setup. Much of perceived bass is felt, not heard. These allow for the perception of an intense substage and midbass without affecting the actual balance of the system. When set-up properly and not abused, you will never 'hear' better kickdrums or extreme low frequencies like you will with these.

info can be found here => ButtKicker®




Amplfiers
Tweeters & Midrange - Pioneer 'PRS-A900'
This amplifier is the my personal favourite piece of my setup. It is designed purely with SQ in mind. There are no crossovers, there is no bass boost, there is no colouration. There is simply 4 channels and separate left and right gains. It employs separate left and right isolated power supplies with symmetrical circuitry. It is class A/B at its best delivering a pure CLEAN 50watts per channel. One of these will be used with one channel providing power to each tweeter and mid range driver.
0.0035
distortion
75db separation
108db SNR

Info can be found here => PRS-A900 - 4-Channel Bridgeable Amplifier with Filter-less Design | Pioneer of Canada - English




Woofers - Pioneer 'PRS-A900'

Another PRS-A900 will be utilized in the front stage to power the woofers. This one will however be bridged to a 2channel amp, delivering 100watts per channel.*see above for photo and info*



Subwoofers - Pioneer 'PRS-D1200SPL

This is a tank of an amp, and will be run at 1ohm to supply 600 continuous watts to each subwoofer. It employs multiple forms of protection circuitry and class D power and efficiency. This amp is a powerhouse delivering clean power, never heating up, and built to last. Its job is simple - make power.

info can be found here => PRS-D1200SPL - Premier Competition-Level SPL Class D Mono Amplifier with 2400 Watts Max. Power | Pioneer of Canada - English(This is obviously the matching amp for the listed A900's from above as can be seen in the picture below)



Tactile Transducer - Pioneer 'GM-D7400'

The goal here was simple. Find an amp that makes rated power, has small footprint, and is efficient. This amp fit the bill. A potential 400 continuous watts will feed the buttkicker mini.

info can be found here => GM-D7400M - Class-D Mono Amplifier with 800 Watts Max. Power | Pioneer of Canada - English






Power and Connections

In total all amps will draw no more than 60amps - most often a fraction of this. To supply this power, true 0 gauge power and ground wires will be used. In addition, a secondary trunk battery will be employed (yellow top optima). Finally the BIG three will be completed to ensure maximum alternator efficiency.Once this is completed whatever further steps are needed will be undergone.

Connections - Audison 'BT6 550' + Monster Cable subwoofer RCA's

These are both high noise rejection cables. The audisons are 6channel RCAs, while the Monster Cables are 2 channel

info on the audison can be found here =>BT6 550




The INSTALL

This is the most important part of the entire setup. You can have the most expensive gear in the world, and if you won't install it right, you may as well stay stock.For the tweeters and woofers, the stock pillar and door locations will be utilized.
In a desire to minimize permanent alterations to the vehicle, the mid range drivers will be placed in a custom made enclosure of the Cruzes' front door cavities.
The subs will be in sealed enclosures behind a fake wall, separating them under the rear deck from the rest of the trunk.
Already measured out, the two A900 amplifiers will be placed perectly side by side in the ECO's spare tire cavity in the trunk. A false floor will be made utilizing two fans to circulate air within.
The 1200spl will be mounted somewhere hidden behind the false wall with the sub boxes.
The tactile transducer with be mounted under the drivers seat with the GM7400 amp under the passengers seat.
Finally in the trunk and small enclosure will house the secondary battery in the very left rear of the trunk.

The doors will be completely sealed and treated with sufficient Mass Loading material such as Dynamat Xtreme. In addition to this, and acousitc dampening material such as dynaliner with be used.
Info on these products and be found here
=> DynaLiner
=> Sheets and Bulk Paks

The rear doors will just be treated with Dynaliner.The entire floor of the car will be treated with dynapad and 20% dynamat xtreme.
Dynapad can be found here => DynaPad

The trunk will receive sufficient treatment of dynamat xtreme alone.

All in all, the system will weigh in at roughly 250lbs. So one chunky passenger.


TO CONCLUDE!

This is the beginning of my build. All of the gear has been purchased. Over the next month I will be picking up the final pieces (harnesses, sound dampening materials, connects, etc).


please discuss, comment, suggest and question!!

[XtremeRevolution]

Have a look at don's products at sounddeadenershowdown.com. IMO, anything dynamat carries pales in comparison, and dynamat is much more expensive. Sure, you get thr name, but thst doesn't mean much.

Any reason why you didnt look at home theater-based drivers? CSS has a VERY nice tweeter with a high xmax and an xbl^2 motor that's hard to beat. While HAT products are nice, I can't see that mid beating that 4" tang band titanium mid.

I wouldn't call the IDMax an sq sub. I have one and I much prefer the v2 and v3 IDQs for SQ use, having heard them all in all sizes. If I had deep pockets, I'd be looking at two IDQs or one of those beautiful Aurasound 12" neodymium subs you can find at madisound.

Have you considered a 2x8 miniDSP instead of a head-unit based dsp? I have yet to find a single Pioneer deck that even comes close. Sure, they're nice...if you haven't used a miniDSP. The value just isn't there when the miniDSP gives you (if I remember correctly) 30 *parametric* eq bands, time alignment, and slopes up to 48db/octave. With. An sq install like this, I really wouldn't say added complexity is something that should steer you away. Not like it makes a difference when you know what you're doing. For a novice, sure, but you're no novice.

There are some things I would have done differently given the drivers I've had experience with in home theater speaker design, but it will definitely be an awesome sounding system.

Sent from my SGH-T999 using AutoGuide App

[thormxkid]

does the miniDSP allow you to tune from the drivers seat?
because if not the would be the down fall compared to a deck that is fully active.
imo stick with the DEX-P99RS.

[Mattburgess]

I used fatmat along time ago in one of my cars . Bought it on ebay for pretty cheap.

[jstoner22]

I have checked out sounddeadenershowdown many times before. Looking at my post it sounds as if I am set on the dynamat - I am not. I am simply going to be using a product that achieves the same effect as those products listed.
I will definitely be exploring all options here. I would never pay full price for dynamat, because like you said, you pay for the name.

The IDMax is absolutely an SQ sub. I have used it and heard IDQ's in many different setups. Pure SQ wise, sure the IDQ may be the popular choice. This does not take away from the fact that the IDMax is still a fantastic sounding sub. Remember, it will be have an SQ oriented box and tune. At the spl levels I will be listening to, the difference between the two will be negligible. I will have the option to have my sessions that I want to blast it though...and it is here the IDQ's will not keep up.

As far as home theatre drivers, I'm simply not sure. Those tang band's could be fantastic. From all of the drivers I auditioned, I just like the L3SE the most. The L3SE's are coming from my last install as well. They were in custom A-pillar pods. Which is another big reason I went with them. A 4" driver was just too obtrusive for what I was looking for at the time.

20120611_110759.jpg




One thing I am sure about is the DSP. Personally I am not a fan. They have their merits, but IMO pale in comparison to the P99RS...and I'll tell you why!

Granted, this is for my needs/wants. 9/10 people the DSP would be the way to go.

1. Complexity of install - not because I want to shy away from it, but because -as you can see from the gear i've chosen- I am proponent of keeping the cleanest audio chain possible. This means reducing items used, minimizing conversions of the audio signal, and greatly reducing the chance for noise to enter the system.

2. IMO the system is only as good as its weakest link. In the past while, stock headunits have leaped forward quality-wise. They are still not even a comparison to the abilities of a P99 though. When used with a stock unit a DSP will work wonders, but it is still going to need to be employed somewhat as a bandaid for the shortcomings coming from upstream.

3. I have 350gig of lossless music. This means that I use my ipod alot. The P99 allows direct bypass of the ipods extremely shitty DAC's. Only a few units do this nowadays. (also, the IPOD interface is fantastic)

4. In seat tuning. It doesn't need a laptop, software, or files to load it. I can access its DSP and tune on the fly with relative ease, without moving.


I could go on for days but I won't lol. The miniDSP is a great piece of gear. Sure it has the P99 beat value wise for its DSP cababilities. Even so, with 31band L/R, individual level adjustment, up to 36db slope etc, one should be able to create a world class system. Would more be nice? sure, but its absolutely not necessary.
However DSP isn't everything. The miniDSP is a great option if you want to keep a stock appearance. I do not. Overall the P99 is a much better option if SQ is your concern and not value.




I appreciate your input! I will try and take a listen to those tang-band drivers if I can find some.
How is their off-axis response. I've always liked my drivers on axis to minimize reflections etc, but I'm not sure I'm going to be able to achieve that here. The L3SE plays great even at 60degrees off.

What product would you recommend for something similar to dynamats DYNALINER and DYNAPAD?
also, I haven't heard those Aurasound subs. What is your experience with them?

What would you have personally done differently with the drivers? (remember i'm not looking at value here)



Any suggestions on midrange install? my only stipulation with this install is that i'm not doing anything to the car that cannot be put back to stock.

Have a look at don's products at sounddeadenershowdown.com. IMO, anything dynamat carries pales in comparison, and dynamat is much more expensive. Sure, you get thr name, but thst doesn't mean much.

Any reason why you didnt look at home theater-based drivers? CSS has a VERY nice tweeter with a high xmax and an xbl^2 motor that's hard to beat. While HAT products are nice, I can't see that mid beating that 4" tang band titanium mid.

I wouldn't call the IDMax an sq sub. I have one and I much prefer the v2 and v3 IDQs for SQ use, having heard them all in all sizes. If I had deep pockets, I'd be looking at two IDQs or one of those beautiful Aurasound 12" neodymium subs you can find at madisound.

Have you considered a 2x8 miniDSP instead of a head-unit based dsp? I have yet to find a single Pioneer deck that even comes close. Sure, they're nice...if you haven't used a miniDSP. The value just isn't there when the miniDSP gives you (if I remember correctly) 30 *parametric* eq bands, time alignment, and slopes up to 48db/octave. With. An sq install like this, I really wouldn't say added complexity is something that should steer you away. Not like it makes a difference when you know what you're doing. For a novice, sure, but you're no novice.

There are some things I would have done differently given the drivers I've had experience with in home theater speaker design, but it will definitely be an awesome sounding system.

Sent from my SGH-T999 using AutoGuide App

[jstoner22]

I used fatmat along time ago in one of my cars . Bought it on ebay for pretty cheap.

I've heard of fatmat for ages now. I'll definitely be looking into it.

Whats your experience been like with it? good? bad?

[Mick]

Where are you mounting the head unit?

[jstoner22]

I will be replacing the stock stereo.
Most likely using metra's mounting kit.







I will check out the scosche kit as well.










which do you guys prefer?

I like the black scosche look more, but i don't like the door chime speaker built in.


I also don't know what i'm doing with the second opening yet. I may just use the pocket to hold my wallet or something while i'm driving. Or I could have some plexi cruze symbol made. Any suggestions?

[XtremeRevolution]

does the miniDSP allow you to tune from the drivers seat?
because if not the would be the down fall compared to a deck that is fully active.
imo stick with the DEX-P99RS.

It does not, but I don't know of any true audiophiles who are afraid to roll up their sleeves and put a bit more time into something to make it work excellently. If you're like me, you'll tune and tune until its perfect.

Sent from my SGH-T999 using AutoGuide App