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2013 Cruze or 2013 Camry?

35K views 117 replies 38 participants last post by  Toyotech 
#1 ·
Hello all,

I've been researching a new car for a few months. I currently have a 2002 Explorer V8, and it's just burning a hole in my pocket with a 25-mile commute one-way, and it's getting a bit long in the tooth at 210,000 miles. Great car, but I do not like the new Ford Focus, and although I like the Fusion, I don't like the 1.6 and it would cost me around $30,000 to get the 2.0T.

So, after driving the Ford Focus, Fusion, and Escape, Hyundai Elantra and Sonata, 2013 Accord, and 2013 Camry and Cruze, I've narrowed my choices down to the Camry and Cruze. I know they are in a different segment, but they are similarly priced. The 2013 Cruze 1LT automatic with a sunroof and RS package, as well as a few other options comes out to around $23,000, and the Camry SE comes out to around $23,500 (24.5 with a sunroof).

So, based on your ownership experience (any of those of you that have owned a Toyota before?), what would you recommend? I have read about a lot of reliability issues - coolant smell, transmission issues, etc. with the Cruze, but I really like the way it drives. I have also read about transmission concerns with the Camry. So neither is perfect from an internet forum perspective, and I am the first to realize that forums are where people come to vent about car troubles. I just want to make an educated decision here.
 
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#44 ·
I considered a Corolla for a while, but was dissuaded by the problem they had with excessive oil consumption once they hit the 100K miles mark. I saw a number of used ones for sale on craigslist that mentioned everything great about the car except for needing a quart of oil every 500 miles. Not sure if they fixed that problem in later years.
 
#46 · (Edited)
Guess it's just the transmission then. Auto + 4 cylinder = snore.

My MT Cruze is a rocket in 1st and 2nd gears, surprisingly quick and responsive for as small as the engine is. 3rd and up? Forget about it...not much power over 45 mph. Cobalt seemed to struggle similarly around 35+ mph (didn't it only have a 4-speed auto?).

FWIW, OP, the Camry doesn't have much off-the-line acceleration if you just punch it from a stop (it does fine with normal driving, but don't expect to win any stoplight races), but it catches up around 20 mph and will pull to 70 with good haste for a 4-cylinder. The 6-speed transmission is well-spaced out for acceleration at almost any speed. My mom's 2007 2.4 Accord will smoke the Cruze from a stop, but it's around the same weight with an additional 28 HP.

The seats in the Cruze are one of the major reasons I bought it. They're extremely comfortable to me - moreso than any other car in the price range, and moreso than the Camry SE or my mom's Accord. I'm 5'7", 150 lbs, so it may be different if you're a bigger person. My 6'2", 250 lbs dad looks a little uncomfortable in the Cruze. It's not my Volvo that was like sitting on a big leather couch, but even after 6 hours in the Cruze, my butt and back didn't hurt. I've heard that the new Honda has good seats though...finally!
 
#49 ·
Yup, 4 sp auto. It can get a little sluggish at midrange but I know how to work the gas pedal to get it to shift faster. I do know that when i drove the Cruze, traffic has slowed to a crawl in my lane so I switched lanes and had to speed up quickly and the car just did not move for a while and the engine screamed like a banshee. My Cobalt will of course take some time to speed up but not like that. It actually scared the **** out of me.
I'm not a big guy- 5'9" 170 lbs but the seat bottom is just not wide enough or deep enough. I could live with it if it had lumbar controls which sadly seem to be removed as standard by many car companies. I think it's ridiculous to put in all the techie stuff but leave out something so important to comfort.
I don't know about the Accord but the 2013 Civic seats were the worst I have ever sat in. Horribly uncomfortable. I at least didn't get a backache from the Cruze seat, I got one after 10 minutes in the Civic. The Subaru Impreza had betters seats than both cars, IMO
 
#47 · (Edited)
Thanks for the responses, guys.

I think the Accord is definitely on our list. It put a big smile on her face when she drove it around, so I'm going to do the swap for Valentine's Day for her. She's been driving this Accord since we met, so I think she deserves it.

Although I do enjoy driving a manual, I did it years ago in a Sentra in Atlanta traffic, and my wife's Accord, and hated the cars at the end of the day for it. My wife works much closer to home, and doesn't have to deal with traffic as much. I'd rather have the automatic.

The 2013 Cruze doesn't seem to "scream" as you said at moderate throttle, but it will if you push it hard. Just feels kinda gutless when really pushed hard, like there's nothing more there than it's already giving you. The dealer offered to let me borrow it for a day; I'm going to try to see if the Toyota dealer will let me do it for the Camry as well next weekend before I make my final decision.

Thank you all very much for your input - the majority of you have been supportive, and I'm glad I found such a great community.
 
#48 ·
Ever notice the new Camry doesn't have weather strip around the front windshield? Big gap there, with an icy rain, would fill that gap, expand and crack the windshield. That was too cheap for me, least the Cruze still has that all important weather strip.

Could have picked up a new 2011 Accord a year ago last summer, loaded with $7,000 off the price, cheaper than a Cruze. Test drove it, was far more boring to drive than my 04 Cavalier. Also recalled how that dealer tried to screw me wanting 300 bucks for a made in Malaysia blower motor. Did find one on the internet for 40 bucks, but had to wait a week to get it. No Thanks.
 
#50 ·
I noticed some people said that leather seats were a problem in hot weather? I have leather in my Cruze and a couple of days ago it was 47C (115F) when I drove to work and the seats were no problem. Also the engine temp was 86C (187F) on my diesel which is about the same as it was at 6C in winter when I bought it in August 2012. The guy who misses his V8 for torque wait for the diesel so effortless to drive.
 
#55 ·
Lol, tan and/or silver = bleh in my book. I owned a gold Accord with a tan cloth corduroy interior. It was pretty hideous. My parents owned several tan leather cars too, and I never liked them.

Aussie, does the Holden have the Z-link torsion-beam suspension the LT/LTZ Cruzes do over here? The rear suspension is a bit noisy, but I think it works well, and the LT Cruze is sure-footed over roads where there are potholes and patches over patches every which way.

Does the Accord still have independent suspension? Anyone know? The 2007 Accord is the best car I've ever driven over bumps and one of the most pleasant highway cruisers I've ever driven. Just shrugs them off. Doesn't corner brilliantly, and the seats are uncomfortable, but it's good until pushed to the limit.

The older Camrys had a lot softer suspension than the 2012 SE (and cornered about like a Buick), but also had a solid rear axle I believe. The back of the car "floated" over bumps quite badly. Still, it was quieter and more pleasant to ride in as a passenger.
 
#60 · (Edited)
It does have a torsion beam but no watts link like the SRI does. When you hit a pot hole with this type of suspension the shock is felt by both the wheels on that axle with IRS it is much smoother as only 1 wheel is involved. I do like the Cruze but it feels less secure than what I was used to as the front pushes more than I am used to. Anyone who has driven an Aussie made GTO will know what I mean as my car was basically a 4 door version of one of these as it is based on the VT Commodore.
View attachment 10367
 
#59 ·
The older Camrys had a lot softer suspension than the 2012 SE (and cornered about like a Buick), but also had a solid rear axle I believe. The back of the car "floated" over bumps quite badly. Still, it was quieter and more pleasant to ride in as a passenger.
The owner of the shop where I take my Cruze for mods, primarily does work on Euro cars (he has Porsche race cars in his showroom) refers to Toyotas as Japanese Oldsmobiles. I kind of agree - driving my parents Avalon - I find it to be very much like driving a large GM car.
 
#62 ·
I do like the Cruze but it feels less secure than what I was used to as the front pushes more than I am used to. Anyone who has driven an Aussie made GTO will know what I mean as my car was basically a 4 door version of one of these as it is based on the VT Commodore.
I know exactly what you mean. I have a 2004 Aussie made GTO. That being said, after moding the Cruze with UR chassis and strut tower bars, my Cruze's handling has improved and the car feels more solid than stock. The GTO is definitely more of drivers/enthusiast car out of the box.
 
#65 ·
Brand loyalty and country loyalty is overrated. I don't care who makes the car as long as it's the best car I can get for my money, and that's what companies need to strive to produce. People around me at work (I work for a real estate company) own more expensive luxury cars and always harped on me for owning a F-O-R-D, but my Ford was more reliable than almost every one of their fancy European cars. I gave Ford another chance - I loved my Explorer Eddie Bauer, the first car I ever bought new, and it is still a very nice car - but didn't like anything they have to offer me right now.

After owning a truck, the ride in anything is more than acceptable, but I did notice that the Camry I test drove had the Michelins on it. I'd still say the Cruze is a bit more comfortable and quiet going down the road. I found the seats in both cars to be just fine.

I want gas, not diesel. One of my friends has a brand-new Passat TDI, and while it pulls down the road nicely, the thing is always broken. I'll take a pass on brand-new technology. I love the new Passat, but his ownership experience has turned me off from buying one.

My salesman gave me a call today. As of tomorrow, I've been offered a Blue Topaz Cruze 1LT RS with MyLink, sunroof, Pioneer audio, and the convenience/technology packages to drive until Friday afternoon. I pick it up tomorrow evening on my way back from work. He said the price on it would be about $22,900. Very excited to take the Cruze around on more than just a short drive.

I pick up a Barcelona Red Camry SE with sunroof, Entune, and a few other novelties on Friday evening to take home for the weekend. I'm hoping to have my decision by Sunday!
 
#66 ·
BTW, although I liked my Ford, I know one of my brother's wife's brothers had one. I sent him an email about it a few weeks ago asking how he liked it. This was his response:

Being a tech, I always drove "bombs". I'm talkin' a 75' Datsun 280Z with rotted floor pans, an 85' Chevy Celebrity Eurosport with again rotted floors, a 91' Corsica 3.1L with 269K miles on it, etc...

I never needed nothing fancy cause if it broke I always brought it back to life for cheap $.

The focus was the first new car I ever bought. I didn't want it to be honest, but with my Ex fiance working a new job on night shift I had to watch my little girl and that meant after work I didn't have no more time to fix anything on the Jalopy so I got something that I didn't have to worry about.

It was cheap, I traded my 02' Chrysler Sebring with 150K on it for it. I got $2,000 on trade and used that as my down payment. I leased it for $199.00 a month.

I got just the plain Focus "S" base model with 5-speed. I'm talking power window's up front and crank roll down in back (like the old Neon.
)

When the car got totaled it has 12,691 miles on it. In those 12K miles it was at the Ford dealership for warranty repairs over 53 calendar days and 24 times. I went through an A/C compressor not even into 24 hours of ownership (they didn't put no PAG oil in at factory and it locked up), a head gasket at 2,000 miles (when they got the cams out they said the head bolts were "finger" tight), three set of front strut mounts, two sets of struts, a sway bar, and links at 7K miles for a "knocking" noise in the front end while going over any rough surface in the road, and a clutch kit and pressure plate for a "chattering" noise in the trans.

I have to say, maybe it is a blessing in disguise I got rid of it. I just wasn't banking on getting rid of it that way.

A chick blew threw a red light at an intersection and I got her in the side. Insurance is still battling it out.
Goes to show that no one manufacturer is perfect. I'm sure people have problems with their Toyotas and Hondas too. My Nissan I owned before the Explorer was a total piece of junk.
 
#71 · (Edited)
Hold your horses, guys - I haven't BOUGHT it yet! :)

Yes, they gave my a 2LT RS because it was one on the lot that came equipped with the sunroof I wanted. They will probably have to special order the model I want (1LT RS), as I don't want the leather seats, and many of the 1LT's are bare-bones that they have at the dealer.

I am really enjoying the car, but I'm dropping it back off tomorrow afternoon to give the other a chance still.

It's a great cruiser on the highway, the heater works great, the remote start is very cool, the leather seats are pretty nice and comfortable, and so far, it looks like I am getting 31 mpg. That's AMAZING. :) I do like the MyLink system, and it's working well with my iPhone.

A couple negatives I have found:
-There is a HUGE blind spot right behind both front doors. Other than this, visibility is very good.
-The upgraded radio isn't that good. It's not even as good as the one in my wife's Accord, and that has one of the worst stereos I've heard. My Explorer had the Mach audio system, and it is worlds above the one in the Cruze.
-There's not enough storage for anything!!!
-The Cruze is peppy around town, but it really struggles to get up to speed once you pass 30 mph. I work off a busy road at 45 mph, and I feel like I really have to romp on the gas to get the Cruze motivated to get out there with the traffic. There's not much in-between - the transmission either shifts at 3,000 RPM or 5,500. I realize it's a small motor and probably needs a lot more revs than most, but I feel bad making it rev so hard. I don't expect a whole lot, but it is down on power even compared to our 2003 Accord 4-cylinder.
 
#74 ·
You can eliminate most of the blind spot. Set your side mirrors so they just barely reveal the rear door handles when you turn your head to look a the mirror. You should check over your shoulder anyways before changing lanes.

The radio in the Cruze seems to get better as it ages. My son, who's a Cellist, thinks the speaker paper cones are really stiff and simply need to be broken in.

I came from a extended length minivan - the lack of storage was a real shocker to me as well. The Sonic is smaller and has more storage.

You must have been driving an automatic transmission. The manuals don't have this issue. There are plenty of members here who can help you get more out of the automatic transmission. It appears the Cruze's AT doesn't like being floored but performs better at half throttle. It does take time to learn how to drive these transmissions.
 
#72 ·
Well, dropped off the Cruze, and picked up the Camry this morning.

I grew to like the little Cruze a lot over the past 2 days with it.

My wife and I have been running errands with the Camry this morning, and she likes it, I like it, but it's just not AS much fun to toss around.

Land vehicle Vehicle Car Toyota camry Alloy wheel
 
#77 · (Edited)
Well, dropped off the Cruze, and picked up the Camry this morning.

I grew to like the little Cruze a lot over the past 2 days with it.

My wife and I have been running errands with the Camry this morning, and she likes it, I like it, but it's just not AS much fun to toss around.

View attachment 10451
That a V6 or the special edition SE 4-banger? Those are definitely V6 wheels, and they look fantastic.

I agree with what obermd said...the manual Cruze >>> automatic for getting the power down to the road from the little engine. It's down on power between 50-70, but highway power in top gear is actually excellent. I went from 62-75 on the highway today just flooring the gas in 6th...without even realizing it. It really drives a lot like the 2.4 in my mom's 2007 Accord. Those are fantastic engines in the Accords...once you get the revs up. Contrary to that, the Cruze has a ton of low-end power and starts to run out of breath above 4,000 RPM.
 
#75 ·
Plz consider the ECO w/6-sp MT

A low carbon footprint & sturdy construction.

from an old wrench
Doc
 
#79 ·
Ironic the number of "foreign" cars on there, ain't it?

Silly "buy American" people.

Rank Make/Model U.S. Assembly Location(s) Rank in July 2011
1. Toyota Camry Georgetown, Ky.; Lafayette, Ind. 1
2. Ford F-150 Dearborn, Mich.; Claycomo, Mo. -
3. Honda Accord Marysville, Ohio 2
4. Toyota Sienna Princeton, Ind. 6
5. Honda Pilot Lincoln, Ala. -
6. Chevrolet Traverse Lansing, Mich. 8
7. Toyota Tundra San Antonio, Tex. 9
8. Jeep Liberty Toledo, Ohio -
9. GMC Acadia Lansing, Mich. 10
10. Buick Enclave Lansing, Mich. -
 
#80 · (Edited)
So, based on your ownership experience (any of those of you that have owned a Toyota before?), what would you recommend? I have read about a lot of reliability issues - coolant smell, transmission issues, etc. with the Cruze, but I really like the way it drives. I have also read about transmission concerns with the Camry. So neither is perfect from an internet forum perspective, and I am the first to realize that forums are where people come to vent about car troubles. I just want to make an educated decision here.
To answer your original question, I'd go Camry all the way, for reliability reasons.

Even though I'm not a real Honda fan (don't dislike their cars, just don't find anything they have that's compelling to me), I'd suggest you also consider the Accord and maybe even the Altima. Both have just had a redesign.

I've posted my personal Prius experiences and that of my parents w/their Toyotas at http://www.cruzetalk.com/forum/9-ch...10877-2013-cruze-2013-camry-4.html#post159260 and http://www.cruzetalk.com/forum/25-service-issues/1420-list-all-problems-youve-had-23.html#post113003.

My mom used to have a 91 Camry V6 that was handed down to me in 97, which I sold early 02 w/~90K miles on it. That car was reasonably trouble-free as well. I don't have a complete repair history but I can think of a few problems of OTOH. When new, the brake warning light would sometimes come on. The passenger's side mirror was faulty and had some distortion. Those were both fixed.

I'm unaware of any major problems while under my mom's possession. When I had it, I had a torn CV boot and messed up CV joint, so I got that replaced. Near 90K miles, I had an intermittent check engine light, which was diagnosed as a EGR hose (IIRC) clogged w/carbon. It was cleared and fixed for <$100.

Here are the Consumer Reports predicted reliability ratings (yeah, yeah, cue the folks who are going to slam CR's reliability ratings):
Camry V6: better than average (we expect reliability of new models will be 27% above average)
Camry Hybrid: much better than average (62% above average)
Camry 4-cyl: better than average (49% above average)
Cruze: average (even though it says 17% below average)

CR's current predicted reliability for the Cruze is much better than its horrific showing at http://www.cruzetalk.com/forum/9-ch...r-reports-cruze-reliability-dec-11-issue.html. However, the '11 is still rated at much worse than average. Trouble spots are engine cooling, transmission minor, climate system, squeaks and rattles w/the worst being engine cooling. Sound familiar? Fuel system, brakes, body hardware, power equipment and audio system have the half red circle, so it's a notch from the best possible score.

Looking back at the Camry, CR goes back to 03. Not a single model year of any of the engine choices of the Camry has even average reliability. All are above average or much better than average.

Here's JDPA's VDS for 2012: J.D. Power and Associates. See http://www.cruzetalk.com/forum/17-o...pendability-study-my-2009-cars.html#post71820 for previous years. I'd expect to see 2013 results in the next 2 months.

My parents had 3 GM cars and 2 Chryslers (well, Dodges). They don't buy American-branded cars anymore and I never have.

I can't speak for the oldest Dodge ('68 or '69 Dart) and our '93 Dodge Caravan was ok except for transmission problems but our Japanese cars (3 Nissans, 4 Toyotas, if I have the count right) have overall been much more reliable than the GM products.

The most unreliable was my 04 Nissan 350Z, which wasn't terrible. Virtually everything I had go wrong luckily was fixed under warranty and some weren't worth bothering out of warranty.
 
#81 ·
#87 ·
Another thing I've noticed - compared to my Explorer's very smooth transmission, both of these 6-speeds are very busy transmissions and the shifts are pretty noticeable. I guess they have to keep busy trying to get the most power out of a 4-cylinder engine.

I remember driving 4-cylinders 10-15 years ago. They were not something you wanted to go near with a 3 or 4-speed automatic transmission.
 
#89 ·
If you use this forum to claim that Cruze is unreliable than you have a problem. Mostly people with an issue post on here to try to get a resolution and so you get problem cars discussed. My 6 month old cruze has no issues, transmission works great, only area where I could complain would be turbo lag at low speeds in my diesel but all I have to do, if this were to worry me, and it doesn't, is move my shift leaver to the left and pick the right gear early. Once over about 15 KPH the problem goes away anyway. This is not a design fault just too few revs to spin up the turbo, the manual would not even notice it. If you want a sports car buy one, if you want reliable transport buy what suits you and leave other peoples choices alone.
 
#91 ·
The last GM 4 cylinder I drove was a Corsica rental in Puerto Rico about 10 years ago. The engine sounded like it was straining just to get out of the parking garage at the hotel. The last GM 4 cylinder I had to deal with long term was the Pontiac Sunbird my wife owned when we got married 25 years ago. The Corsica had the same engine. The Ecotec engine was definitely not designed by the same people.

As for CR, my personal experience over the last 20+ years is exactly opposite of CR's recommendations. Based on this I do NOT trust CR to review cars.
 
#92 ·
I have actually had 2 Cruze's, a 3rd if you count my fiances right now. I love Gm and loved the Cruze but the cars sure did have some issues. I have a identical Camry to the one you posted but in black and I love it. I had:

'11 2Lt Auto. I liked the car, day I got it window busted out and broken into can't blame the car but it still sucked. Then at 700 miles I had a bad thermostat and the car overheated in a bad area, definitely did not make me too happy. The dealer fixed it, so I can't really complain.

'12 LS Auto. I really liked this car. The LS always gets a lot of bad reviews but I never had a problem with the 1.8 and averaged the same mpg as the LT. I eventually traded it in on my Camry because I wanted a bigger car with more bells and whistles.

My fiancé has a '12 LT and she has taken it in at least 5 times for a leaking sunroof, steering wheel buttons breaking, little things. Sunroof still leaks.

I really don't have any complaints about the Cruze so I'm not trying to be negative. But if your getting both cars for similar prices definitely go for the camry. 0 problems , same mpg, way way more room someone can actually sit behind you in the back. Better resale value, Cruze drops at least 8,000 first year off of MSRP I'm guessing because there are so many rentals. For the 14,000 I got the LS it was a great car, but I can't believe how many people on here pay 25,000 + for a Cruze. Just my two cents.


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