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2013 Cruze or 2013 Camry?

35K views 117 replies 38 participants last post by  Toyotech 
#1 ·
Hello all,

I've been researching a new car for a few months. I currently have a 2002 Explorer V8, and it's just burning a hole in my pocket with a 25-mile commute one-way, and it's getting a bit long in the tooth at 210,000 miles. Great car, but I do not like the new Ford Focus, and although I like the Fusion, I don't like the 1.6 and it would cost me around $30,000 to get the 2.0T.

So, after driving the Ford Focus, Fusion, and Escape, Hyundai Elantra and Sonata, 2013 Accord, and 2013 Camry and Cruze, I've narrowed my choices down to the Camry and Cruze. I know they are in a different segment, but they are similarly priced. The 2013 Cruze 1LT automatic with a sunroof and RS package, as well as a few other options comes out to around $23,000, and the Camry SE comes out to around $23,500 (24.5 with a sunroof).

So, based on your ownership experience (any of those of you that have owned a Toyota before?), what would you recommend? I have read about a lot of reliability issues - coolant smell, transmission issues, etc. with the Cruze, but I really like the way it drives. I have also read about transmission concerns with the Camry. So neither is perfect from an internet forum perspective, and I am the first to realize that forums are where people come to vent about car troubles. I just want to make an educated decision here.
 
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#2 ·
My Toyota experience may be old.
'77 Corolla SR5 Liftback. Had it 10 years, 100K+ miles. Clutch slave cylinder replaced. It lasted all of 15 minutes on the dealer's lot when I traded it in.
'80 Celica GT Liftback. Had it 10 years, 98K miles. No mechanical failures.
Having said that, I've bought Hondas and Mazdas since.
I'm still looking for that new car to buy. Local auto show will be here a week after the Detroit one, so we'll go look and sit there.
 
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#3 · (Edited)
I own one of both (both 2012 models), and I was between the same two in making a decision. I love both cars for different reasons. The Cruze is a sexy beast and fun to drive, and the Toyota isn't too bad looking either.



I would absolutely buy the Camry over the Cruze. Why? Reliability. I've owned the Cruze since April; my girlfriend has owned the Toyota since July (10,700 and 8000 miles, respectively).
In that time, the Cruze has been into the shop for:
1. Defective struts knocking inside of 1,000 miles.
2. AC expansion valve malfunctioned; no AC on hot days.
3. Recirculate flap in the climate control was not working.
4. AC not cold - compressor replaced. Still ain't cold, unless I've been on the highway for a while. I gave up caring.
5. Brake rotors warped within 5,000 miles - replaced under warranty. Clutch spring "twanging" when released; also fixed.
6. Speedometer needle jumped up to 120 when at a stop. Dash module reprogrammed.
7. Steering "sticking" at highway speeds. Steering rack (!) replaced under warranty. :angry:
8. Developing coolant smell with heat on. Not even gonna bother taking it to the dealer yet.

The Camry is going in this weekend for a transmission software update that makes the downshifts a little softer. We have had ZERO problems with it so far - only a tire rotation and oil change.

She's owned a 2002 Camry V6 since I met her 3 years ago, and we beat the crap out of both of our cars at the time travelling back and forth 4 hours on weekends to see each other for about a year. Took its toll a bit on the old Volvo, but the Camry has needed nothing in all 10 years her family has owned it but a timing belt and valve cover gasket besides oil changes, tires, and brakes. Boring car, but very reliable.

All in all, I've been to the dealer about 9 times so far - WAY, WAY too much for a brand-new car. My 14-year old Volvo with over 200K was more reliable. I would not buy another Cruze. I love the car, but it's pissing me off. I don't pay $300+ a month to be constantly inconvenienced by a brand-new car. This is stupid stuff that shouldn't break yet. Makes me worry about the future once the warranty is up. Many people on this forum have had similar problems, and while I know that a forum is a place for people to vent (which I have mostly refrained from), it's good to see that at least I'm not the ONLY one having bad luck with this thing. The car is built very, very well - especially for a GM, and I know that the engine will last a long time. It's just all of the small things.

It's not *as* fun to drive, but the handling on the SE model is great (especially for a Toyota), the transmission is well-designed, and the 2.5 I4 engine is plenty peppy. The AC is amazing, the stereo is amazing, the interior is very nice; it gets good gas mileage, and rides pretty well. Look for a model with the Michelin tires - the Bridgestones are atrocious and noisy.

The Cruze is much quieter road-noise wise, but the engine in the Camry is quieter. Cruze is a better highway car, hands down. Camry is a better in-town car. Stock radio in the Camry is very nice, with a touch-screen infotainment system. The MyLink system on the 2013 Cruze is an option, but it is very nice and well-worth the upgrade...the stock radio leaves a lot to be desired. As to be expected with the class difference, there's a TON more room in the back of the Toyota. Cruze's interior is better, and the seats are more comfortable. It feels more "solid". The Cruze has a lot more "character", if you believe in such a thing.

Gas mileage from the Camry so far matches pretty much what the window sticker says - 25 in around-town driving (26 for the automatic Cruze); 35 highway (38 for the Cruze). It got 40 @ 70 mph on one trip where the Cruze got 43.
 
#4 ·
to make a recommendation, we need to know what exactly it is you are looking for. If it's just economy- the Cruze ECO can get you 50+ mpg (but no sunroof/ leather, I think). From the 1st post it looks like you are mainly interested in economy.

I got the 2013 2LT and it has the mylink system standard (option on the 1LT) & am satisfied with the functionality. It drives well- better than the camry. Can't comment on the cruze transmission, as mine is a MT. I get 30 mpg with 85% city driving.

The only things about the cruze I need to get used to is the fact I can't secure stuff in the trunk. There is no way to lock the seatbacks and trunk to prevent them from opening. And the only way to open the trunk with the engine running is to have it in park & use the trunk button on the trunk (this is difficult to communicate with someone trying to load the trunk for you- basically forcing you to get out & open the trunk yourself)

As you can see from my petty complaints, the car is overall pretty good. If you can provide more details on your requirements, we can provide more helpful feedback ...
 
#6 ·
Wow, thanks for the detailed response JBlackburn!

to make a recommendation, we need to know what exactly it is you are looking for. If it's just economy- the Cruze ECO can get you 50+ mpg (but no sunroof/ leather, I think). From the 1st post it looks like you are mainly interested in economy.
A nice, reliable car. The Explorer has been very reliable, but only gets 14-18 mpg. I don't care which gets better fuel economy - anything's better than that.

I want an AT as I drive in-town a lot, and I want a sunroof. Eco is out. Don't really want leather - gets too hot in the summer.
 
#8 ·
Have a 2012 Cruze LT. In over 1 year and 13,500 miles I have had zero problems. Before the cruze I had a Cavalier for 12 years and 160,000 miles with no major problems. Buy the Cruze and treat it like a compact economy car.......not a sports car. I wonder how many people blame the car when they are just tuning them and beating the **** out of them because they have a turbo. Also, anybody that thinks foreign cars have no major problems live in fantasy land.
 
#10 ·
Same old story here. You'll get responses from the few who have big problems, and then you'll find those like me, who have 18,000 miles, or about what jblackburn's Camry and Cruze have put together. My car has been to the dealer twice; once to replace a windshield wiper nozzle that started leaking, and once to replace the front struts due to a bad batch from a vendor. Both times were painless and happened over 10k miles ago. No problems to speak of here, and there are more people on this board who share the same experience. My brakes are not warped, and my A/C works fine. I'd hardly say the Camry is guaranteed to have no problems whatsoever.

Always remember that forums attract those who have any issues and that they are not representative of the general population. That said, I don't see the two comparisons as valid. A Cruze 1LT will cost you ~$18k, while a Camry LE will be $4k more than that. If you wanted to compare the Camry to something, you'd compare it to a 2013 Malibu.

That said, my review of the Cruze may be of some help to you. I have a review of the Malibu in progress.
Behind the Wheel of the Chevy Cruze - The Xtreme Revolution
 
#11 ·
I forgot about the struts! That was another dealer visit.

But it looks like he's already priced it out and knows what he wants between the two. Both of our cars were around the same price when it was all said and done (yay rebates!)

Also, if you can find a 2012 model, you can get it for a lot cheaper if there are any still on lots. No major changes with either except the MyLink on the Cruze.


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#12 · (Edited)
Its all about you. I have been through 2 cruzes, over 20,000 combined miles, and had no issues.

The Crude, however is still a relatively new car with a drive train (1.4 liter models). That is relatively unproven.

The Camry has been around forever and I believe this newest model hasn't changed much over the last few years.

In terms of reliability, you have a better chance of getting a good reliable car with the Camry. This isn't to say that Toyota is superior, just that the Camry has been around much longer so it won't have the bugs like SOME Cruzes do. (Let me stress that the mass majority of cruzes are good reliable cars like mine were) You still have a chance of getting a problem car like anyone does buying any car. But that chance is less in my opinion.

That being said, the Cruze has all the comforts, better gas mileage, and much better looks.

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#13 · (Edited)
The Cruze is much quieter road-noise wise, but the engine in the Camry is quieter. Cruze is a better highway car, hands down. Camry is a better in-town car. Stock radio in the Camry is very nice, with a touch-screen infotainment system. The MyLink system on the 2013 Cruze is an option, but it is very nice and well-worth the upgrade...the stock radio leaves a lot to be desired. As to be expected with the class difference, there's a TON more room in the back of the Toyota. Cruze's interior is better, and the seats are more comfortable. It feels more "solid". The Cruze has a lot more "character", if you believe in such a thing.

Gas mileage from the Camry so far matches pretty much what the window sticker says - 25 in around-town driving (26 for the automatic Cruze); 35 highway (38 for the Cruze). It got 40 @ 70 mph on one trip where the Cruze got 43.
I test drove the Camry before buying the Cruze and and noticed the same thing about the Cruze being quieter, a better road car and feeling more solid. Fortunately, I'm over 14,000 miles and have not had any problems. I would make the same decision again.
 
#14 ·
Thanks Xtreme, I had read that review before - I've been poking around forums for all of the cars I've been looking at for a while. I know I am looking at two cars in different segments, but they are comparable in price (around $23,000 for the options I want on the Cruze, and around $23.5-24 for the Camry) and are both what I've liked so far. I do not like the Malibu.

I just want something comfortable and reasonably fun to drive. My wife has a 2003 Honda Accord, and while it has been a great car, it's very unexciting to drive and the seats hurt on long trips. Both the Cruze and Camry have impressed me with their driving dynamics. I will keep the Explorer around for hauling and towing duty/as a 3rd car, since it's not worth anything to sell. And I've had a lot of good memories with the old truck.

I do like the MyLink system, so I will stick with comparing the 2013 Cruze.

One question for you guys - is the Z-link rear suspension worth it? I like the looks of the RS package, especially in red, but I could do without.
 
#21 ·
I can't say I noticed quite that large of a difference between my Eco and the LTZ I drove.

One has to consider when comparing a Cruze with the z-link suspension and one without. To my knowledge, the Eco does not have it, while the 1LT, 2LT, and LTZ do have it. I'm not sure about the LS.

Point being, if you buy an eco, not only do you not have the z-linnk suspension, but you also have the "crap for grip" LRR tires, so you can't really blame the reduction in handling ability solely on the lack of the z-link suspension. In fact, it's impossible to do so unless you put the same wheels and tires on both cars.

I haven't read anything that would indicate that the z-link suspension does more than provide additional stability over bumps.
 
#16 ·
My dad bought a new camry last month and after seeing my new ltz last saturday, he said thats what I should have bought! You have to know my dad he just doesent say stuff like that i was shocked! He really was impressed with all the features of the Cruze. He told me I did good.
 
#18 ·
My cousin has a 2012 Camry and we have a 2011 Cruze. He got his Camry before we did our Cruze. I really liked his Camry and was for sure if I had a chance to buy a brand new car, that would be it. Until we went to a Dealer who had our Cruze on the lot. Talk about Love at first sight! To me, the Cruze is way more fun to drive/ride. We get better gas mileage than he does. I personally like the seats of the Cruze better for longer rides than I do that of the Camry.

One thing you have to think about though..are you planning on Trading this car in down the road for a newer one,or keeping it for years to come? I'm not positive on this, but I believe the Camry holds it's Value better than the Cruze. Of course once the Cruze is around longer, that may not be the case.

I think you'll win with either choice. Both are very nice cars!
 
#28 ·
One thing you have to think about though..are you planning on Trading this car in down the road for a newer one,or keeping it for years to come? I'm not positive on this, but I believe the Camry holds it's Value better than the Cruze. Of course once the Cruze is around longer, that may not be the case.
The 2011 Cruzes are not doing well in the value holding department, except the eco. However, The 2012 cruzes are best in class over the civic, corolla and focus. the Corolla is a somewhat close second. I am sure the 2013s, which is what he is looking at, will carry on this trend
 
#19 ·
Buying a Toyota anymore is just practically the same as purchasing a US brand of car, both are dictated by the government. Still hanging unto my 88 Supra, was designed by top American Engineers with Italian styling. Japanese were highly interested in invading the US market. Also forced American industry to produce higher quality.

I did get every option in my Supra except for leather, Japanese used some kind of rat skin for that. One advantage of buying a Cruze, we have a Stacy to help with that. With Toyota, may deal with a white guy, but he has to answer to a yellow guy. All vehicles can have problems. Had problems with my Supra that I would have resolved here with a domestic car, that yellow guy said no. Took care of those myself, but was quite angry.

In my neck of the woods, these Japanese vehicles rust out far quicker than the domestics. If it wasn't for the internet, would have gotten rid of my Supra a long time ago. Toyota dealers rob you blind on parts.

One thing I really like about it, doesn't have that dumb looking cowboy type of icon, Toyota introduced that later.

In the mid 80's to the early 90's my entire huge family was driving Honda's, Nissan's, and Toyota's, but that change after the Japanese devaluated the US buck. As far as I am concerned, the same kind of junk made here.

Other things that bug mem is that the ratio of US patents held by Japanese corporations is ten to one for US patents held by US corporations. Try and get a Japanese patent as a US citizen. Japanese corporations are even worse than US corporations to outsourcing to 3rd world countries. And we are still spending trillions of our dollars for their military defense. If they had to pay for their own, would really have to pay a small fortune for a Toyota.
 
#20 ·
Because of historical reliability issues and public perception, Toyotas tend to hold their resale value better than GMs. Of course, when you get to 10 years and close to 200,000 miles there really isn't a difference.
 
#30 ·
Chevrolet Cruze Reliability vs. Toyota Camry Reliability

According to this, the Camry is well above average in reliability, while the Cruze is average.
Online publications for late model vehicles with reference to reliability are useless, for a few reasons.

1. They are new cars. Predicting reliability based on historical trends is a joke. Honda and Toyota's decline in recent years, but it seems people think they were the same as they were in the late 90s. Not so much.
2. The Cruze is a new model and the reliability of it is based on the 2011 year, which had a significantly higher likelihood of problems than the 2012 year, which had many problems resolved before the car ever got to the dealer. The same can be said comparing the 2012 and the 2013 model years. If you are looking for a new car today, comparing the historical reliability of even the Cruze in light of these facts is a futile attempt.

A 2013 Cruze is going to be more reliable than a 2012 Cruze, which is going to be more reliable than a 2011 Cruze. I'm saying this as a general statement with regard to the total ownership of these vehicles and likelihood of problems being encountered. Any comparison publications will fail to address this.
 
#33 · (Edited)
First part of the statement is true. The second is not. The Camry began a new generation w/the '12 model year. Interior and exterior are totally different. The Camry Hybrid also got a boost in power and mileage at 41 mpg combined which is quite good for a 200 hp medium-sized car.
The powertrain however - the 3.5 V6 (fanTASTIC engine) and the 2.5 I4, as well as the 6-speed auto are tried and true, and have been in production over 5 years. Should be relatively problem-free. Unlike the Corolla, they're still competitive and offer good performance/fuel economy.

That said, despite it being reliable, I dislike his Rav4. It's a piece of crap IMHO. It's slow, noisy, doesn't have a very good ride, has a cheap interior and feels tipsy. I've never driven a vehicle as tipsy feeling as that. I would never want to own that generation of Rav4. (And, I'll admit I'm a Toyota fan.)
Yeah, my best friend in college had one. POS. Never broke though.
 
#36 ·
The powertrain however - the 3.5 V6 (fanTASTIC engine) and the 2.5 I4, as well as the 6-speed auto are tried and true, and have been in production over 5 years. Should be relatively problem-free. Unlike the Corolla, they're still competitive and offer good performance/fuel economy.
FWIW, re: the Corolla (which I'm no fan of), the Corolla is actually still competitive in terms of FE despite not having a high EPA highway rating. Take a look at the combined mileage at Compare Side-by-Side vs. various Cruze automatics.

In Consumer Reports' FE testing, the Corolla made #4 and 5 at Best & Worst Fuel Economy | Most & Least Fuel Efficient - Consumer Reports under small sedans. In the same FE tests, they beat out all the Cruzes they tested.

For comparison (I've posted these before in another thread), here's what the Cruzes got in their tests:
'11 LS 1.8L 6AT: 26 mpg overall, 17 city/36 highway
'11 1LT 1.4L 6AT: 26 mpg overall, 17 city/36 highway
'12 Eco 1.4L 6AT: 27 mpg overall, 17 city/40 highway

At Small Sedans | Fuel Efficient Sedans - Consumer Reports and Are the high-mpg versions of the Chevrolet Cruze, Ford Focus, and Honda Civic worth the money?, they mention the 27 mpg overall for the Cruze Eco vs. 32 mpg overall for the Corolla.
 
#34 ·
Thanks for the input guys. I've approached a few owners in parking lots (creepy, I know) and asked them what they think of their cars. I'd say a good 4/5 of them love their cars.

I'm going out tomorrow to sit down with both dealers and talk numbers. I'm also going to talk to the service department at Chevy to see if they can get me a car with the antifreeze smell TSB already taken care of.

With all this car shopping, my wife is starting to want to trade in her Honda too! Oh boy.
 
#37 ·
No way i'd buy a subaru. The auto in the impreza is a CVT, and is almost a full second slower in the 1/4 mile than the Cruze.

My Cruze is the slowest car i've ever owned by a decent margin, can't imagine owning something considerably slower.

I have no faith in subaru reliability or engineering. They're faux performance cars, even the WRX, STI and especially the BRZ are a joke IMO. I test drove a $32K 2012 WRX, was half asleep by the time i got back to the dealer. What a turd. It's quick if you launch it from 5500rpm, by the time you hit 30mph the fun is over. Body roll is comical for a "sports" car, and it had insane heat soak also.

How many legitimately fast STIs are there? Very, Very few. How many 400+whp Evos are there? Plenty.

I've tried to understand subarus and their generally cocky owners, never been able to. My buddy owns a well known subaru performance shop, they do everything from timing belts to full builds and dyno tuning. He has a constant stream of cars with blown motors from piston failures coming in. Endless work, he can't keep up. Sometimes he has 4 or 5 cars waiting for pistons, rebuilds, or swaps...whatever the owner chooses after their bolt-on car can't handle 325whp and cracks a ring land.
 
#39 ·
I'm surprised its slower, when I drove it it felt pretty peppy. Also surprised about all those issues, does he mainly work on WRX's? I assume they are beaten up pretty badly. Subaru is supposed to be reliable, I know 3 people who own other models with zero issues. The CVT felt better than I thought it would and I generally hate them
And the Boxer engines are SO NOISY.


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Yes, definitely noise is a factor. The CVT whines as well. The Cruze is much quieter.
 
#40 ·
Well, we ended up taking the wife's car around this weekend to car shop. We stopped at the Honda dealer again at her request, which is right across the street to the Toyota dealer, and I got the chance to drive the Accord Sport I4 in a stick shift. My first drive in the Accord, I was a bit overwhelmed by all the gadgets, but the 2nd drive I just had a lot of fun with the car.

The salesman took a look at our car and offered us a decent trade-in price, so we're now thinking of replacing both cars with two different models. She also loves the Accord and has a short commute to work without much traffic, so it will probably be her car and mine to have fun with on weekends.

The Cruze is still in the running, and I love the fun-to-drive character, but after driving it again in traffic moving 45-55 after the Accord and Toyota, I just felt that it was underpowered and needed to be floored to really get out in traffic, and I'm not sure if I could go from a big, powerful V8 to that.
 
#41 ·
I have yet to take a look at the 2013 Accord, but I really want to.

If you REALLY want to spoil your opinion of all of them, drive the V6 versions. Both cars have FANTASTIC V6 motors that will put some "sports sedans" to shame. :)

I know what you mean. The Cruze has decent acceleration around town to keep up with traffic, but if you really need to move quickly out into traffic already moving, the gears are short and you have to push it hard. The 2011 automatic I drove liked to rev quickly to 5000 RPM and scream through 1st and 2nd gears when I wasn't even stepping on the gas that hard around town just getting up to 35-45 with the normal pace of traffic. The manual LS/LT are much, much more well-behaved.

You mentioned that your wife liked the manual Accord - are you open to a manual, or want an auto for your commute?
 
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