Chevrolet Cruze Forums banner
1 - 20 of 99 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
16 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Got a 2013 Cruze LT with 1.4T and 6 speed.... only had in two weeks, but have noticed some harsh "shudder" in the drive train at certain times, but could never figure out for sure how to replicate.... I finally did tonight!

Here is what happens... start the car, put into gear and accelerate.... first, second, third... keep accelerating to 20ish mph, and SHUDDER.... then shift into fourth....

NOW, if I stop and pull over and try it again NO shudder.

BUT, if I stop and turn the key off and try it again SHUDDER....

EVERY. SINGLE. TIME.

So easily to replicate.... what is confusing me is that it ONLY does it the first time after being started and never seems to do it again.

Anyone else ever hear of this or had this happen to them?
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
25,596 Posts
Are you sure it's at 20 MPH? At 12.4 MPH (20 KPH) the ABS system tests the ability to pulse the brakes. This only occurs the first time you pass 20 KPH after starting the car.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
4,147 Posts
Are you sure it's at 20 MPH? At 12.4 MPH (20 KPH) the ABS system tests the ability to pulse the brakes. This only occurs the first time you pass 20 KPH after starting the car.
Does this happen on all cars or just on some as I have never felt this on my car?
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
25,596 Posts
All the North American Cruze do this. I barely notice mine it anymore.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
108 Posts
It's actually been around for quite a while, I had an 02 Century with ABS and Traction Control, and it does the same thing though it didn't do it only once, it did it "periodically" as a safety feature of both TC and ABS - if it detects an issue it turns them both off, both lights on the dash go on and the Service Vehicle Soon light goes on as well (at least it did in the Century). I assume the Cruze tests it more often than you think with TC, ABS and StabiliTrak.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
25,596 Posts
I suspect there is a test that occurs on every braking action, but it's not the same test as what occurs the first time the car passes 20 KPH.
 

·
Resident Forum Drunkard
Joined
·
9,273 Posts
Is this the AT or MT ? And or does these affects from the computer controls , body management system cause shuddering ?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
108 Posts
Is this the AT or MT ? And or does these affects from the computer controls , body management system cause shuddering ?
It's the electronic braking control module, and would be both AT and MT. This is a few years old but is probably still accurate:Power-Up Self-Test

The electronic brake control module (EBCM) is able to detect many malfunctions
whenever the ignition is ON. However, certain failures cannot be detected
unless active diagnostic tests are performed on the components. Shorted
solenoid coil or motor windings, for example, cannot be detected until the
components are commanded ON by the EBCM. Therefore, a power-up self-test is
required at the beginning of each ignition cycle to verify correct operation of
components before the various control systems can be enabled. The EBCM performs
the first phase of the power-up self-test when the ignition is first turned ON.
The system relay, solenoids and the ABS pump motor are commanded ON and OFF to
verify proper operation and the EBCM verifies the ability to return the system
to base braking in the event of a failure. The master cylinder pressure sensor
performs a self-test by sending a series of specific voltage signals to the
EBCM, each for a predetermined amount of time. This phase of the power-up
self-test may be heard by the driver, depending on how soon the engine is
cranked and started after turning ON the ignition. The second phase of the
power-up self-test begins when the vehicle is driven at a speed greater than 12
km/h (7.5 mph) and the EBCM has not detected any traction control module
(TCS)/vehicle stability enhancement system (VSES) related malfunctions thus
far. When the brake switch indicates that the brake is not applied and the
master cylinder pressure is detected as being low, the EBCM proceeds with the
test. The EBCM isolates all of the wheels by closing the 4 isolation valves.
Due to the fact that all of the wheels are isolated during the second phase of
the test, the test must be aborted if the brake is applied while the test is
being performed. Occasionally, the driver may detect this by experiencing a
momentary hard pedal.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,166 Posts
Yup i notice it every restart with my car.Somtimes we have to tell customers about it to.It is very noticeable if the radio is off
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
168 Posts
So that's what that is. Thought I had a gremlin type electrical problem that was denying fuel to an injector or two momentarily. Now to locate the ABS fuse and pull it. Hope that cures this annoyance. Black tape over the ABS light and a note to self to put the fuse back in for annual safety inspection..........

I have the humanoid version of ABS in reserve, so don't worry about me crashing on slippery roads - it's called pumping the brakes. Learned how to do that in 1964 from my dad. Not from the creeps that teach Drivers Ed.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
5,157 Posts
So that's what that is. Thought I had a gremlin type electrical problem that was denying fuel to an injector or two momentarily. Now to locate the ABS fuse and pull it. Hope that cures this annoyance. Black tape over the ABS light and a note to self to put the fuse back in for annual safety inspection..........

I have the humanoid version of ABS in reserve, so don't worry about me crashing on slippery roads - it's called pumping the brakes. Learned how to do that in 1964 from my dad. Not from the creeps that teach Drivers Ed.
Disabling the ABS also disables the traction and stability control. You might not want the ABS, but TC and SC are darned handy during inclement weather, avoiding a deer or when a kid runs into the street, or some texting driver cuts you off. Skidding into somebody that could have been avoided is expensive.

Besides, all those systems work very well on the Cruze. The ABS will still let the tires leave skidmarks when stopping. The TC and SC have a bit of leeway programmed in so the car can get a little bit loose before they reel things in. The TC and SC can also be completely disabled via the on/off switch if needed. GM did a fantastic job implementing those systems on the Cruze.

Leave the ABS alone.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
718 Posts
So that's what that is. Thought I had a gremlin type electrical problem that was denying fuel to an injector or two momentarily. Now to locate the ABS fuse and pull it. Hope that cures this annoyance. Black tape over the ABS light and a note to self to put the fuse back in for annual safety inspection..........

I have the humanoid version of ABS in reserve, so don't worry about me crashing on slippery roads - it's called pumping the brakes. Learned how to do that in 1964 from my dad. Not from the creeps that teach Drivers Ed.
ABS can pump the brakes 15 times per second. A human foot can't even do 1/3 of that.

Imagine the field day an insurance company would have if they found out you disabled an on board safety system and had an accident.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
16 Posts
Discussion Starter · #14 · (Edited)
The car is a 6speed auto.

Ok... no it's not 12MPH... I drove very carefully this AM(with radio and heater off) and listened, and I can hear a "click" at 12MPH like you say.

What I am talking about is MUCH harsher and causes the car to "buck" a bit... almost like a bad gear change would(or like a small pothole), but it's EXACTLY between 3rd and 4th gear.... 20MPH is where it happens at light throttle... today I tried "medium" throttle and it happened at about 25MPH instead... you'd swear it was a hard/bad gear change, but if I shift myself in "manual" mode... it still does it... it shifts fine into third gear... then a second later a shudder like a bad gear change.

BUT like I said... ONLY the first time after starting the car. Subsequent starts and stops will not do it unless I actually shut the car off and turn it back on again.

Thanks for all the replies so far!
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
25,596 Posts
Post #7 in http://www.cruzetalk.com/forum/57-how-library/12035-how-15-6-gallons-into-eco-mt-tank.html:

To do this with "just a few gallons" in the tank is inviting disaster. Gasoline is extremely volatile. When you first lift the fuel pump module out of the tank, the vapor space in the tank above the remaining gasoline will be "rich" - meaning above the upper explosive limit. But as soon as you expose that vapor space to air (by way of the big hole in the tank where you took out the module) the vapor space may very well drop into the explosive range. A gasoline-air mixture in the explosive range is extremely easy to ignite from any tiny spark, including static electricity. If this happens when you are kneeling over the tank, you could be severely burned and injured. And since it is a plastic tank, the tank will be on fire suddenly and depending on where the car is, the flames could spread to the car - and it's mostly plastic nowadays. So, please, please, please - if you are going to attempt this modification, figure out some way to drain the tank completely and then let it "air out" for a couple of hours - go get a Starbucks giant coffee and relax while you relish the idea of going 600 miles between fill ups. Can't drain the tank completely and in too much of a hurry to let it air out? It would actually be safer to do this modification with the tank completely full. This eliminates any vapor space, so there cannot be a vapor-air explosion in the tank. 15 gallons of gas weighs about 90 pounds, so get to the gym and do some bench presses for a few weeks before doing the job with a full tank. Sorry to rain in this parade, but as a Fellow of the Society of Fire Protection Engineers and a Senior Member of the American Institute of Chemical Engineers, I am bound by a code of ethics where I must point out unsafe ideas and practices. The safest way to go 600 miles between fill ups is to get on the wait list for the new Cruze Diesel!! Because I spent my whole career preventing fires and explosions in chemical plants, paint plants, pharmaceutical plants, etc., I don't know how many lives I saved with my recommendations and designs for safe operaations/maintenance procedures, but I may have just saved yours if you were thinking of doing this mod "with a few gallons in the thank." Happy Motoring!!

So that's what that is. Thought I had a gremlin type electrical problem that was denying fuel to an injector or two momentarily. Now to locate the ABS fuse and pull it. Hope that cures this annoyance. Black tape over the ABS light and a note to self to put the fuse back in for annual safety inspection..........

I have the humanoid version of ABS in reserve, so don't worry about me crashing on slippery roads - it's called pumping the brakes. Learned how to do that in 1964 from my dad. Not from the creeps that teach Drivers Ed.
HYPOCRITE: I have copied verbatim your post in Firehawk618's thread about how to swap out the fuel pump and sending unit in the ECO MT in order to reverse GM marketing's max fuel weight reduction so that we can get the last three gallons into our tanks. In that post and further in the thread you went on about how this modification is dangerous. You said you're bound by a code of ethics, which I highlighted here, when it comes to safety, yet you are now wanting to disable a US Federally mandated safety feature in your Cruze because it annoys you. More people are killed on our highways every year than in manufacturing explosions. This is true even with the recent explosions in Texas and Florida.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
25,596 Posts
The car is a 6speed auto.

Ok... no it's not 12MPH... I drove very carefully this AM(with radio and heater off) and listened, and I can hear a "click" at 12MPH like you say.

What I am talking about is MUCH harsher and causes the car to "buck" a bit... almost like a bad gear change would(or like a small pothole), but it's EXACTLY between 3rd and 4th gear.... 20MPH is where it happens at light throttle... today I tried "medium" throttle and it happened at about 25MPH instead... you'd swear it was a hard/bad gear change, but if I shift myself in "manual" mode... it still does it... it shifts fine into third gear... then a second later a shudder like a bad gear change.

BUT like I said... ONLY the first time after starting the car. Subsequent starts and stops will not do it unless I actually shut the car off and turn it back on again.

Thanks for all the replies so far!
Thanks for the clarification. Now hopefully someone will have an idea about what you're hearing/feeling. The fact that you got it to change speeds may also be important.
 

·
Administrator
Joined
·
15,765 Posts
ABS can pump the brakes 15 times per second. A human foot can't even do 1/3 of that.

Imagine the field day an insurance company would have if they found out you disabled an on board safety system and had an accident.
Truth.

For the record, I no longer refer to them as accidents. I refer to them as collisions.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
5,157 Posts
I would go to your dealer and see what they say. Since you can reproduce it, give it medium throttle going out of the dealer lot so the tech feels it too. Then pull over, shut the car off, and demonstrate it again. The chances of it being fixed increase if you can get it to shudder on command.
 
  • Like
Reactions: obermd

·
Registered
Joined
·
16 Posts
Discussion Starter · #19 ·
Yes, it will shudder on command every time after each start. Works FLAWLESS besides... I'm very happy with my Cruze!! Especially fuel mileage.... my old Regal GS(3800 s/c) was a beast when it came to power, but also TERRIBLE for fuel mileage.
 

·
Resident Forum Drunkard
Joined
·
9,273 Posts
Some days at some given point in time there happens to be an epiphany !
 
1 - 20 of 99 Posts
Top