Chevrolet Cruze Forums banner
1 - 20 of 34 Posts

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
6,917 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·

·
Resident Forum Drunkard
Joined
·
9,273 Posts
CNG sweet Lil tank in me trunk , :signs065:​ BOOOOOOM ....
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
4,147 Posts
This is the car I sold to buy my Diesel Cruze. It is a 1999 Holden Commodore 5 speed manual with a 3.8 V6 engine and duel fuel petrol / LPG (Propane}. The petrol tank was 75 liters and the gas tank was 70 liters. I once drove 1400 km (870m) without putting any fuel in and still had fuel left. This trip was with 4 adults and luggage. Unless there have been some developments this conversion isn't suitable for boosted engines. View attachment 33938 View attachment 33946
 
  • Like
Reactions: spacedout

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
6,917 Posts
Discussion Starter · #4 ·
CNG sweet Lil tank in me trunk , :signs065:​ BOOOOOOM ....
GM has sold many bi-fuel cavaliers and 6.0L 2500 Silverado trucks at times over the last 10 years, never heard of one blowing up. The Cavalier had a 6-8gallon equivalent tank between rear wheels in the trunk(similar to this cruze system), the Silverados have the tank mounted in the front of bed in a tool box.

CNG is great, unlike E85 there is only a couple MPG reduction from regular gas. It also cost $1.50 a gallon where I live so would be great with an 8 gallon equivalent tank, would cost $12 to fill CNG tank and add 200+ miles range. Since $12 usually only buys 4 gallons, using the CNG would be like doubling my MPG(cost wise).

Aussie might be correct, this may only be available with the 1.8L cruze. Even if thats the case, as cheap as an LS cruze is this kit being available would give me at least one more reason to consider the 1.8L.
 

·
Resident Forum Drunkard
Joined
·
9,273 Posts
That is why I love ya Brother . Always thinking And I agree CNG and LNG are a great resource for alternative fuels . and they are cheaper then Petrol .
 
  • Like
Reactions: Patman

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
4,147 Posts
That is why I love ya Brother . Always thinking And I agree CNG and LNG are a great resource for alternative fuels . and they are cheaper then Petrol .
Before you get to into CNG, Sydney has a fleet of CNG vehicles (buses) and are phasing them out because of too much downtime. CNG runs at a much higher pressure than LPG and doesn't go as far on a tank. LPG in Australia costs less than 50% of petrol price and goes about 80% distance. CNG is a bit cheaper but only goes about 50% of petrol distance. I suggest you do some research before you commit yourself to CNG.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
6,917 Posts
Discussion Starter · #8 · (Edited)
Before you get to into CNG, Sydney has a fleet of CNG vehicles (buses) and are phasing them out because of too much downtime. CNG runs at a much higher pressure than LPG and doesn't go as far on a tank. LPG in Australia costs less than 50% of petrol price and goes about 80% distance. CNG is a bit cheaper but only goes about 50% of petrol distance. I suggest you do some research before you commit yourself to CNG.
I don't think the drop is anywhere near that much, with my 2004 cavalier it was EPA rated at 31mpg hwy, with CNG it still got 29mpg EPA highway rating. Sure the range is less with only an 8gallon equivalent tank, but I can go over 250 miles on 8 gallons of gas in my cruze, so 200+ miles with CNG is pretty good at less than half the cost.
 

·
Resident Forum Drunkard
Joined
·
9,273 Posts
What is causing to much down time on those buses Aussie ?
Will definitely do research before I jump .
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
6,917 Posts
Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Surely seems like an interesting idea. But what size tank in a car? Take it off your gas grill($20 a tank)? What did the Cavalier use?
The Cavaliers I have seen use a 6 Gallon Equivalent tank for CNG. Since this is a pressurized gas though one needs to find a station that has enough PSI at the pump to actually fill the tank. From what I read a few years back allot of the time one can only get a 80% fill. Some great pictures of the Cavalier CNG on this link below. This one has the 2.2ecotec, they also have older ones with the 2.2L OHV engine. This website always has used CNG fleet cars/trucks forsale. The second link is a youtibe video showing a CNG cavalier, there is actually quite a few videos on youtube of them.
CNG Utah - 2004 Chevrolet Cavalier Bi-Fuel

and

CNG Cavalier - YouTube

The GM cars/trucks are all Bi-fuel(can runs gas or CNG & switch on the fly), the Honda Civic CNG is only CNG. I would only ever buy a bi-fuel if I was looking at CNG. I found a few websites with CNG station info, see below:

CNG Stations | Refueling | Prices | Map

and

CNG stations and Prices for the US, Canada and Europe
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,383 Posts
I also noticed the IMPCO post on their website about 6 months ago, but I couldn't find any information of cars that have been retrofitted.

It appears that the certified retrofit cost is around $10,000 USD. I'd be interested if anyone does this in the Midwest if there's tax incentives. Last I checked there wasn't anything significant.

Unlike electric technology right now that has a $7,500 tax credit if you quality.

CNG is just now breaking into Minnesota by Kwik Trip. I only wish it was closer, and right now the payback isn't there for me.

If anyone finds any federal incentives for CNG conversions please start a thread.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
6,917 Posts
Discussion Starter · #14 ·
CNG is just now breaking into Minnesota by Kwik Trip. I only wish it was closer, and right now the payback isn't there for me.
I have a kwik trip 14miles from home that just added CNG, so I would have a pretty close source. I have seen aftermarket kits in the $15,000 range, but surprisingly when new the CNG 2004 cavalier was under a $3,000 option if I remember correctly. Seems maybe the high cost can be offset if someone can make them on a larger scale. The 2004 cavalier only 1% of car sold came with the CNG kit.

I have a feeling GM will only ever offer this in fleet cruze models, simply because the public is not informed about how great CNG really can be(price is less than half gasoline, low emissions & 95% of the MPG). There is no demand for CNG cars/trucks when the infrastructure is pretty crappy & the general public has no clue.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,383 Posts
Spacedout-

On the other thread that I started several months ago, a car dealership in Utah was mentioned. They had pictures of the factory window stickers for those cavaliers. Even back in 2002-2004 it was something like a $7,000 option. I think it really makes sense in states like Oklahoma, where CNG can be found pressurized ready to go under $1.00 per gallon.

The other option is to use a Phill (it's the CNG device that you connect to your low pressure resedential line to fill a car. That's like $5,000. CNG has to catch on in the truck world, where there's more fuel usage, and then dribble into automobiles as more filling stations are created. The Kwik trip 50 miles from me is selling CNG for $1.79 per gallon. Even at a savings of $2.00 per gallon it takes a long time to calculate the payback.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
6,917 Posts
Discussion Starter · #16 ·
I would only save like $1000 a year using CNG, so if it was $7,000 I would have to drive 7 years to break even. That's about the same break even point of buying a diesel car or truck when one drives a normal amount of mileage per year.

The CNG cavalier I could have bought from the chevy dealer was only about $3,000 more than normal with all the rebates and incentives GM was offering at the time, never knew it was actually $7,000 or I would have bought it.

If I was going to buy a CNG vehicle I would choose a truck, since CNG it gets about the same MPG but cost half as much as gasoline, that's the same thing as going from a 12mpg truck to a 24mpg truck. Heck even some of those used trucks on the utahCNG website start looking nice when I think about that.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
4,147 Posts
My Commodore used LPG which is a much lower pressure fuel than CNG. That 80% fill someone mentioned is standard to allow for expansion in warmer weather and is not counted in the tank capacity, and the pump automatically shuts off when tank is full. The prices I have seen mentioned seem rather steep. The tank in my picture holds 70 liters of gas, (18.4 gallons) and on the freeway i ran it till the engine started to die and got 604km (375 miles). The conversion cost $2400.00 and I got a $2000.00 rebate from the government so out of pocket was $400.00. Nearly all taxi.s in Australia run on straight LPG and have very few problems, no more than petrol cars. I had the conversion done 5 years before I sold the car and it cost less on fuel than my Cruze diesel.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,383 Posts
Aussie-

Yea LPG is pretty expensive in the US. I just filled the tanks on the BBQ for cooking and paid $2.19 per gallon. This was at a farm supply store where LPG is cheap because it's used on the farm. Other locations were $3.89 per LPG equivalant. Petrol is only $3.69 for the cheap US 87 octane, so it's not popular.

One problem with LPG in the Northern US is vapor pressure. Due to the cold temperatures in the Midwest -20C in winter, you can have problems starting propane engines. Most are bi-fuel, using gas to start when cold, and then converting to LPG.

The US has a lot of natural gas, a lot more than LPG, the problem becomes the fueling infrastructure is so spread out. It's great if you live in a state that has tax rebates for CNG, but heaven forbid you travel out of that area with a car that can't take petrol.

Electric is everywhere, but that has it's own challenges, that we won't get into.

I'd like to see more CNG, LPG in my area vs. Ethanol. Ethanol on a equal basis is just as expensive as gasoline in my area. Ethanol also takes a lot of energy to refine. Where CNG and LPG are byproducts of the petroleum industry.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
4,147 Posts
For some reason when you buy LPG for household heating etc it is really expensive about 3 times what you pay for LPG when you fill up at the service station directly into your car. Most service stations have at least one LPG pump and one or more diesel pumps. Cars with LPG also have to have a red diamond on both front and rear number plates with LPG written on them. My Commodore had a system where it always started on petrol and when set to LPG it automatically changed over with the first rev up of the engine.

View attachment 34409
 
1 - 20 of 34 Posts
Top