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The really sad part is that it would have cost a lot less if. GM had done it right in the first place and 124 people would likely be alive still.
 

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That woman whose 16 year daughter was killed wants to see some in jail. When I first got my Cruze, was brushing that cruise of switch that has the same effect as killing the engine. Can I sue GM for a million dollars? Probably not instantly recognized the problem and corrected.

Typical ignition switch had lock, off, accessory, run, and start positions. So what do these ignition switches revert to? If lock, all the way down, would really pose a hazard, so why do they even have locking steering wheels? Prime purpose was a thief deterrent, but proved worthless, so why do they still have them?

If more commonly switching to the accessory position that would instantly kill the engine. But this is not the only reason why an engine will quit, darn things are made so complicated like code store in volatile ram. hundreds of electrical connections that only take one corroded terminal that can kill both fuel injection and ignition. Where are the warnings that a fuel pump in a gas tank can go at any instant? Compounded by putting tons of corroding salt on the roads.

My major problem with my own kids struggling to go to college with no money to put gas in the tank, running out of gas is a major problem. Or can be causes by a stuck fuel gauge.

Then what about driver's training if an engine does fail, have you ever heard of such a thing. Trained my own kids how to deal with it, but got the hint when learning how to fly where the instructor would intentionally kill the engine to make sure I was always watching for a safe place to land. But would only do this with my kids with a zero traffic road until they got the hang of it. Why aren't people trained to deal with this issue?

Engine on my motorhome killed on me just two miles after filling up the front 30 gallon tank, with traffic behind me an not thinking, just acting switch on the hazards to warn other drivers.

Was on the inside lane and could pull over, thought maybe I filled up with water, but had a quick option, switched to the rear tank, engine fired up again and was good to go. Mostly use that front tank to check my mileage, actual problem was my fuel filter was plugged up. Rear was clean, hmm, must be buying dirty gas, three bucks and ten minutes later fixed this problem.

But with most of our vehicles, we have only one tank, so not why a reserve?

Then the other issue are there specifications for the minimum amount of torque required to rotate this switch? If so, never heard of one, certainly no government regulations, just about everything else is regulated. Ever see such a gauge to check this, ever read this in a shop manual?

Far more common problem is the switch is too difficult to rotate, has to release the force imposed by that steering wheel lock, and older vehicles used a speedometer cable type of device to lock the gearshift in park. Then cheap brass tumblers in die cast that correct to make both inserting the key and rotating it.

Not one, but four daughters where a couple liked to hang a bunch of junk on their keys. Admittedly, didn't think about kick the switch out of run, at 16 years of age these were my cars, and was more concerned about getting scratches on the steering column, get rid of that junk.

Just saying their are other reasons for these kinds of accidents, most predominate is lack of proper training how to deal with them. Also state laws, while my kids received their driver's license at 16, were not permitted to drive alone, and since these were my vehicles and I was paying for the insurance, that other adult person was me. They don't even teach kids how to drive on the interstate, let alone how to deal with vehicle problems.

Maybe after this, will have driver's training to deal with this, and a tool to check ignition switch rotation torque. Idiots are still teaching hand over hand steering with fast ratio steering where hardly turn the wheel 30 degrees.
 

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Hey I hate Chevies too can I have a Dollar .LOL .. ahuh ...
 

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Top detent is barely a force of one ounce on a one foot lever, bottom is about double this, seems so minor compared to other faults with todays vehicle. Like a wife's co-worker with a seized front wheel bearing causing an accident. No claim, her insurance covered this incident. These can seize without any warning, no way to lubricate them and exposed to sever road salt.

Sure glad my wife wasn't driving our Cruze when the power steering went out, that took a huge amount of force to keep this thing on the road. Then I think about the huge battle I had with Chevy about those worthless rear disc calipers they put on my car with the brake pedal going clear to the floor, but could pump them up.

These are really major problems.

900 million with about a total of 350 claims involve averages to about 2.5 million bucks per person, quite generous, assume the ones that were killed received a much greater share.

With the crazy kid that hit me breaking the law, judge only hit him with a $100K, that's all the insurance he had. Took three years to settle this and already ran up $60k in medical expenses. Both my health and auto insurance companies were there to collect that off the top. Attorney got a third of that with a bit more with expenses, didn't leave enough money for me to get a cup of coffee.

Didn't check to see how many customer complaints there was about a slightly weak ignition switch. Did say it slipped from run to accessory. Just sounds incredible.

Another problem I ran into with my so-called accident, insurance companies had all the top law firms tied up, had to settle for second best. And coming in second with only two contenders was not very good.
 

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i love how GM CEO walks away with no jail time for allowing the deaths. If my actions on the construction yard where to kill 124 people because of my negligence i would be behind bars. the mega rich prove again they are above the law, and we the people have allowed it to happen
 

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i love how GM CEO walks away with no jail time for allowing the deaths. If my actions on the construction yard where to kill 124 people because of my negligence i would be behind bars. the mega rich prove again they are above the law, and we the people have allowed it to happen
The current GM CEO, Mary Barra, was apparently kept out of the loop by the "good ol' boy network" in pre-bankruptcy GM. There's been speculation this network pushed her to the top to be a scapegoat, but the more this got investigated the more it showed she really had nothing to do with this. Also, the DoJ and DoT (transportation) did say they were still looking at criminal charges against former GM employees. They didn't say at what level, just that they were still looking. This settlement is a quasi-criminal settlement that will allow GM to stop looking over their shoulder for something the previous generation of GM leadership was responsible for.
 

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even if she was unaware she should have looked into it faster when deaths where reported and notified the dot of a possible problem rather then pull the i didnt know card. if im promoted to manager at the dealer and find lazy and problematic salesmen its not my job to look into it and clean up vs playing the i didn't know card.

but yes she should not get 100% of the blame because she didn't build the problem she just stood idle.
 

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even if she was unaware she should have looked into it faster when deaths where reported and notified the dot of a possible problem rather then pull the i didnt know card. if im promoted to manager at the dealer and find lazy and problematic salesmen its not my job to look into it and clean up vs playing the i didn't know card.

but yes she should not get 100% of the blame because she didn't build the problem she just stood idle.
She wasn't in any position prior to her being promoted to CEO that gave her the authority to look into this issue. This was one of the findings of the government's investigation. As soon as she became CEO she did start looking into this. Another change in GM since she became CEO is the high level focus on safety across all brands. This simply wasn't there before.
 

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Stuff like this upsets me, and I believe Delphi is long out of business like Delco, was sold to private investors with promises from GM for long term contracts. But GM would only pay them below their cost for manufacturing a product. Can't stay in business very long at this rate. Claim Delphi supplied this weak switch.

GM sure had some idiot CEO's in the past like that what's his name, killing the five divisions and combining them into one back in the 80's.

Now I am concerned about my Cruze to hit that magic 2 ft-oz minimum torque. Smallest torque wrench hits 200 ft-oz, not worth a darn at 2 ounces.

If I can figure how to use a plastic soda straw 8" long and tie that to the ignition key and hang a 3 ounce weight at the end of it, and the switch stays in the run position. I should be okay.

I did occassionally knock my key holder the dropped down from the key in my Supra knocking it out of the run position. But rather than yelling and screaming and going into a complete panic and hitting a tree. I just calmly switched it back on. Since I modified with remote entry that dangles down from the key, this doesn't happen anymore.

Is two ounces enough? Maybe they should make this around 75 pounds.
 

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I did occassionally knock my key holder the dropped down from the key in my Supra knocking it out of the run position. But rather than yelling and screaming and going into a complete panic and hitting a tree. I just calmly switched it back on. Since I modified with remote entry that dangles down from the key, this doesn't happen anymore.
This ^^^. I wonder how many of these accidents could have been avoided if the driver had basic emergency operations training.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
This ^^^. I wonder how many of these accidents could have been avoided if the driver had basic emergency operations training.
Sometimes though the steering wheel column locks. I found this out the hard way as a kid when I turned off the engine and coasted for miles in my Corolla. When I went to turn it back on I couldn't. Never did anything like that again!
 

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Sometimes though the steering wheel column locks. I found this out the hard way as a kid when I turned off the engine and coasted for miles in my Corolla. When I went to turn it back on I couldn't. Never did anything like that again!
Good point.
 

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For whatever reason my wife when pulling into the garage would rotate the steering wheel to the left then switch off the key. Easy with power steering. When I got in, couldn't rotate the key, but had to rotate the steering wheel to the right to relieve the pressure. The key releases a pawl from the steering wheel, and with lots of pressure on it, you would break the key first.

Eddy, all you had to do was to work the steering wheel back and forth with some force. Of course with the engine off either with hydraulic or electric power steering with the switch off, would take some force.

With later model vehicles can't even lock the steering wheel until with an AT, you put it in park first. This drops a pawl in the output drivetrain into a cogged wheel that locks the differential. With some transmissions, this would not engage until the vehicle slowed to under 7 mph, others didn't have this feature, but not widely advertised.

A kid in high school driving his dad's bran new 54 Buick did this while drag racing his dad's new car and shove it into park. Back wheels smoked and parts and piece of the transmission felt unto the road with over three gallons of fluid.

Now does the Cruze also do this? Anybody here want to try this out? We have a manual. Just see if it will go into park at 60 mph, but assuming the electronics would prevent this with a high Vss signal.

With my 82 P-30 and 88 Supra, can leave it in neutral with the parking brake on. So if anyone bangs it, no concerns about also wrecking my transmission. Locking in park is yet another attempt at anti-thief that doesn't work with flat bed trucks nor a gun held to your head.
 

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Sounds kind of iffy to me, with over 3 million vehicles with this switch only a couple of hundred injuries and about 124 deaths contributed to this low torque to turn switch, the percentages of mishaps is practically insignificant and what about other mitigating circumstances? Then only talk less than an ounce in key switch torque.

Then talking about spring tension in vehicle that are over eight years old, all springs lose tension with age, even your strut or leaf springs. Could also ask the question, why are these people driving vehicles with loose switch. Another cause of so-called accidents is driving with a low pressure tire. A tire will overheat with that continuous flexing and blow out.

Whose to blame about this, but another will major cause of an under inflated tire is road salt that seeps into the rim causing corrosion and leaks, so why isn't road salt blamed for this? Also gets into the fuel tank connector causing corrosion that disables the fuel pump, killing the engine, heard no recalls about this. Not to mention corroding your brakes so they don't work anymore.

If any ignition switch should have been recalled is the ones used in the 90's, EPA banned electroplating in this country and raw copper was used for contacts. Turns green, copper oxide that is an excellent insulator, this would also kill the engine because the system wasn't getting 12 volts anymore.

To get around this, ignition switch is firing a voltage to a computer input, but if you have a corroded battery terminal, high voltage transients are produce that can corrupt the code stored in flashram. And like your home computer without software, it won't do anything. Millions of transistors are use to get that spark to the ignition and a pulse to those injectors. If any one of those transistors shorts or opens, you are dead meat. But had to do this to meet EPA emission requirements when the main cause is burning a carbon based fuel. Try and fight this.

Electric power steering was mandated by the EPA to save having to recycle about a pint of power steering fluid. One corroded connector pin here would disable it.

This list can go on and on, maybe they should recall all the vehicles, they are all throwaway. To compound this issue, Americans are the least brightest in maintaining their vehicles compounded by incompetent dealerships.
 

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With locking steering wheels if you park on a diagonal on the street that is always downhill due to the crown on the road. And your right tire hits the curb, you will never be able to unlock it. Have to call a tow truck, but even this won't work. That locking mechanism if made of the cheapest pot metal and is easily distorted where it is permanently jammed.

The key reason the gear shift is locked is that some people claimed their running vehicles, unattended ran over their own kids with multi-million law suits against the manufacturer. So added that lock solenoid with a shaft the goes into a hole as part of the gear shift lever. Also integrated with the ignition key lock so you cannot remove your key until its in park. To release that solenoid has to be energized with a closed brake switch.

These switches are not hermetically sealed. Walking through a salt slushy parking lot getting your shoes loaded with the crap with no way to shake it off, it melts and by capillary action, that salted water will creep up get into the brake switch, corrode the contacts, so you can get it out of park at all.

Anti-thief has proved more effective in preventing the right owner of the vehicle from starting their cars, then in preventing thief. Again the list goes one. Getting bored of reading this?
 
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