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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I have the new car bug bad. :banghead:

This site is full of information and I been looking through many of the threads. But, thought it would be helpful to post my situation and hope that people could chime in with there thoughts, comments or insights.

Currently, I have a very clean 2004 Honda Civic HX. It has been a great car and consistently gets me around 38 MPG during the winter and 40-42 during the summer in the Seattle area.


If I am going to make purchase now it will either be the Cruze Eco or Elantra GLS with a manual transmission. However, I still have a few questions about Chevy and the Cruze:
- I have owned Hondas for over 20 years and this is the first time that I am considering a Chevrolet since the 80’s. GM is sort of renewed, but I have to admit I am a bit concerned the old dealership network has remained. Anyone have any insight on this one?
-Can I or should I expect the Cruze quality to be on par with my Honda?
-Is it reasonable to expect the same level of service as I received from Honda?
-Based on some of the comments on a few of the threads it seems there is an expectation that the car value will not hold. Is this strictly based on Chevrolet past or are there other factors?
- Are there any fuel mileage improvements for the manual transmission models in 2012?
-Is there anything special that has to be done during the motor break-in period since the motor has a turbo?
-According to the 2012 order guide for the Cruze the NAV may be an available option. Any idea on the cost? Also does anyone know if the price is going up again for the Cruze with model year 2012?
-One dealer has ordered the color and options that I want (exterior: black and interior: Black/sport red) and according to the order number they provided it is has a current status of 4B00 “Your car is bayed and is waiting for transportation by truck, rail or transfer to vendor”. However, it seems like it may be a bad time to buy a car right now with the shortage of smaller cars due to the gas prices. Is there any advantage or reason(s) that I should purchase one now rather than wait for the 2012s and potentially rebates or discounts to reappear later this year?
-Anyone have any insight on the best way to negoiate a good deal for my car as a trade-in?
 

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This site is full of information and I been looking through many of the threads. But, thought it would be helpful to post my situation and hope that people could chime in with there thoughts, comments or insights.

Currently, I have a very clean 2004 Honda Civic HX. It has been a great car and consistently gets me around 38 MPG during the winter and 40-42 during the summer in the Seattle area.


If I am going to make purchase now it will either be the Cruze Eco or Elantra GLS with a manual transmission. However, I still have a few questions about Chevy and the Cruze:
- I have owned Hondas for over 20 years and this is the first time that I am considering a Chevrolet since the 80’s. GM is sort of renewed, but I have to admit I am a bit concerned the old dealership network has remained. Anyone have any insight on this one?

No, sorry.

-Can I or should I expect the Cruze quality to be on par with my Honda?

The cruze is nothing like any of the late 90's early 2000 gm vehicles. The quality of the Cruze is excellent and it seems GM has put a lot of effort into making this a great car for an economy price tag.

-Is it reasonable to expect the same level of service as I received from Honda?
I would think so.

-Based on some of the comments on a few of the threads it seems there is an expectation that the car value will not hold. Is this strictly based on Chevrolet past or are there other factors?

Not sure

- Are there any fuel mileage improvements for the manual transmission models in 2012?

As far as I know only improvement was on the auto. Note though the Eco manual easily exceeds the EPA 42 mpg highway if you drive it right. My last tank was 42.7 MPG with a mix of city/highway. Average speed was 49 km/h. This tank I am on now is getting 52 MPG with an average speed of 89 km/h

-Is there anything special that has to be done during the motor break-in period since the motor has a turbo?

No.

-According to the 2012 order guide for the Cruze the NAV may be an available option. Any idea on the cost? Also does anyone know if the price is going up again for the Cruze with model year 2012?

Not sure.

-One dealer has ordered the color and options that I want (exterior: black and interior: Black/sport red) and according to the order number they provided it is has a current status of 4B00 “Your car is bayed and is waiting for transportation by truck, rail or transfer to vendor”. However, it seems like it may be a bad time to buy a car right now with the shortage of smaller cars due to the gas prices. Is there any advantage or reason(s) that I should purchase one now rather than wait for the 2012s and potentially rebates or discounts to reappear later this year?

There isn't to much changing between the 2011 and 2012. Some colors being dropped from what I hear. I have read however that GM/Ford will be doing away with all of these rebates so you may be better off to buy now while some still exist.

-Anyone have any insight on the best way to negoiate a good deal for my car as a trade-in?

Personally I just went straight to the salesman and told him what I wanted. I test drove the vehicle at a different dealership. I then went into the dealership I bought the car off of, walked up to the salesman and made him an offer and said I would sign the papers right away. I say price was my only concern and once we had a deal I would test drive. I gave him my price and the options I wanted and we worked it out from there.
 

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If you read the forums on the Elantra, and take a look at fuelly, you will noticed that the Cruze Eco gets better mpg then the Elantra on average. That being said….

- I have owned Hondas for over 20 years and this is the first time that I am considering a Chevrolet since the 80’s. GM is sort of renewed, but I have to admit I am a bit concerned the old dealership network has remained. Anyone have any insight on this one?

-- I have not had much need to go to the GM dealerships. My Cavalier (lease) did not go in once in the 3 years I had it. With the Cruze, so far my experience had been good. They are really concerned with “their score card” and seem to be doing everything needed to get you to rate them good.

-Can I or should I expect the Cruze quality to be on par with my Honda?

-- Yes. My best MPG on a tank has been 46, that was 95% city. I do drive conservatively now (never did before this car) mainly because I decided if I was going to buy an car like this I would make it work for me. I do a lot of coasting/light predicting and slow accels. More aggressive driving I get 36 – 38 mpg city.

-Is it reasonable to expect the same level of service as I received from Honda?

-- Unknown

-Based on some of the comments on a few of the threads it seems there is an expectation that the car value will not hold. Is this strictly based on Chevrolet past or are there other factors?

-- 2010 Cobalt and the 2010 Elantra hold equally relative depreciation values related to original price. I suspect they will continue if not improve.

- Are there any fuel mileage improvements for the manual transmission models in 2012?
-Is there anything special that has to be done during the motor break-in period since the motor has a turbo?

-- No

-According to the 2012 order guide for the Cruze the NAV may be an available option. Any idea on the cost? Also does anyone know if the price is going up again for the Cruze with model year 2012?

-- A lot???


-One dealer has ordered the color and options that I want (exterior: black and interior: Black/sport red) and according to the order number they provided it is has a current status of 4B00 “Your car is bayed and is waiting for transportation by truck, rail or transfer to vendor”. However, it seems like it may be a bad time to buy a car right now with the shortage of smaller cars due to the gas prices. Is there any advantage or reason(s) that I should purchase one now rather than wait for the 2012s and potentially rebates or discounts to reappear later this year?

-- GM sales are up, even though they have decreased the amount of reward programs. I suspect they will only appear again if sales slump considerably. In addition, 2012 gas prices are predicted to be higher than 2011, so small car / good efficiency is likely to continue to be in shortage.

-Anyone have any insight on the best way to negoiate a good deal for my car as a trade-in?


-- Kelly blue book it, look at some private local sales and go from there. You may want to consider selling it outright.
 

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I think my only advice would be on comparing the quality of a 2011 honda to the Cruze...I think it a bit unfair to compare your 8 year old car in quality to a new car. From my understanding that HOnda and Toyota have slipped in quality.

Take a look at the new honda's and compare it to the chev and hyundai and then you should be able to make your decision.

As for service...any American car will be cheaper to repair over a Japenese or Korean car any day all day, with parts being more readilly available.

Happy hunting!!
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Thanks for the replies and input!

Would like to say if Honda still was building cars styled and priced like they did eight years ago, I probably would not be out on this forum. :)

My wife rode in the back seat of the Cruze and did comment about the stiffness of the seats and said the Elantra wback seat was more comfortable. So I was wondering if anyone heard of any changes in that area for 2012?

IMO the Elantra is a better price when comparing it to the ECO. The Elantra makes you feel like you are getting more car for the money. Reminds me of the Honda Accord Lxi in the late 80s. However, I am equally impressed with the Cruze test drive and I agree that the quality seems vastly improved. I would say it feels like a better quality car compared to the Elantra. Too me it was more fun to drive the Cruze and I agree the MPG figures definitively seem better for the Cruze Eco on fuelly. However, there seem to not be many of the MT Elantra's on fuelly either.

Service is one of the most worrisome points for me. I am glad to hear there is some attention being paid to satifying the customer. Of course, I understand that this varies from dealer-to-dealer. But my overall experience with Honda has been very good and am hoping that Chevrolet now "gets it" and will work agressively to rebuild the trust in the brand.

Disregarding the service issue, I think it is going to come down to is the Cruze Eco worth paying the price difference (about $2500 more from my shopping) to have a sportier car.
 

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I used fuelly as an example, looking at the elantra upper side peak, there is one at 35 mpg. On there Cruze there is one at 40 and 41 MPG. I am going to say for this example there is a 6 mpg difference on average between the Elantra and the Cruze.

So for an example the difference between 34 mpg (elantra avg) and 40 mpg (Eco avg), @ 14000 miles a year.

14000/34 = 412 gal
14000/40 = 350 gal

Difference is 62 gallons, or 208 a year at 4$ a gallon. Over 5 years that is 1000 right there. Just something to consider.

Also, you are looking at a 31 hp difference with better fuel economy.
Something else to consider.

The manual trans and auto for the elantra are rated at the same MPG, the gear ratio on the cruse MT is better for gears 4, 5, 6. So your getting a trans geared toward better fuel economy.

Suspension is better on the Cruze, as are the rim and tires. Its more then just a sportier car, it’s a more efficiently designed car.

The elantra has a sportier look IMO, has more room as it is a mid size car. Seats are more comfortable partly because they are bigger, and because elantra did a really nice job.

So I think the question is …

How important is MPG to you, as the Eco really exceeds at this, and does so in a heavier car giving it a more planted feel and a higher HP engine with turbo.

Is the Cruze front seats comfortable, or are the Elantra more to your liking? You’re the one driving. How important is the back seat to you? If the Elantra is more comfortable, you may want that.

Comfort or MPG and Price difference seems to be the main questions.
 

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you can always tell about the person by looking at what they drive. if i was to see anyone driving a Hyundai, my first thought would be that they are japanese. second, they have no style. third, they must have good income for if ever there needs repaired. and fourth, why not buy american made?
 

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you can always tell about the person by looking at what they drive. if i was to see anyone driving a Hyundai, my first thought would be that they are japanese. second, they have no style. third, they must have good income for if ever there needs repaired. and fourth, why not buy american made?
1.) Hyundai was founded in South Korea not Japan. It is now much more global with plants all over the world including USA/Canada.

2.) I personally think the new Hyundai's have a lot of style and the Sonata is a better looking car than the Cruze. I picked my cruze for its other reasons.

3.) The price to repair foreign vs domestic has come down substantially. In fact your Cruze is quite likely more foreign than some Hyundai's or so called "Japanese" cars. The Cruze was designed by GM Korea and the engineering was done by Opel which has no locations any where in North America. So hate to break it to you but GM and Hyundai and all of the other larger car companies are now global. The whole domestic vs. import is starting to fade away. Sure they may have started in one country or have headquarters in one country but they are global companies supporting employee's and factories, and design teams world wide. As well as selling there vehicles world wide. If I remember right the Cruze has 8-10 production facilities world wide.
 

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If the Elantra had the manual trans in the Limited I would have considered it even more than I did originally. However, the GLS just didn't do it for me and price difference (almost $2000 less for the Eco) made my choice a no brainer. FWIW, I haven't looked back!
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Ah, more great comments. Thank You! :)

Eric123 you make some great points and for your information lilpreachaman, the Honda Hx pictured above was assembled in East Liberty, Ohio with 65% of the parts made in Canada/US. I still have the window sticker that documents these facts. Up to this point it is the best American built car I ever owned. :)

The only reason that I am considering an Elantra is because they are now assembled in Montgomery, Alabama.

Last night a Hyundai dealership allowed me to bring home an Elantra over night. The problem was it was an automatic and it helped remind me why I dislike the automatic transmission so much. It was very comfortable and roomy. My wife said the back seats are much more comfortable. But the lack of a manual transmission made it not at all engaging or fun to drive. Vetterin make a good point that the lack of Nav in the Elantra due to not offering on a manual is disappointing.

Additionally, the points that Quazar makes on the fuel economy are import things that I am considering. I did approximately a 70 mile loop about 70% highway and found as long as I was on highway it was in the high 30s, but almost any hill or widing road eroded the fuel economy and the average was 34 MPG, which is below what I get on the Hx. I suspect that manual transmission would have fared better.

I believe the Cruze feels like a higher quality and refined car after driving the Elantra last night. Maybe because the Cruze weights more, the weight of the Elantra is only about 150 lbs. more than the Honda. The Cruze turbo is nice and it seems very responsive and it feels like the power is equal between the Elantra and Cruze.

But to be fair, I think that I will need to go do another test drive of Cruze Eco to ensure that I have a fresh comparsion. Oh the burden that is upon me. :)
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Oh, that is interesting review and thread. The difference for me the Cruze Eco MT will cost me $2500.00 more than the Elantra GLS MT as it stands right now. Anyone have any idea what it takes to obtain or qualify for the $1K loyalty bonus (I've not owned a Chevrolet since the 80's)?
 

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Oh, that is interesting review and thread. The difference for me the Cruze Eco MT will cost me $2500.00 more than the Elantra GLS MT as it stands right now. Anyone have any idea what it takes to obtain or qualify for the $1K loyalty bonus (I've not owned a Chevrolet since the 80's)?
All it would probably take is you saying I am not buying this car unless you give me $1000 more off!!

It's worth a shot...everything is negotiable :th_coolio:
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Some verbage that I found on the web:

"In order to qualify for any of these savings you must have owned the qualifying vehicle for at least 6 months. The vehicle must currently be registered to someone from your immediate family that resides in your household. You do not have to trade your loyalty vehicle in. You can only use a GM Loyalty Program once for each qualifying GM vehicle"

My Mom owns a Pontiac, but she does not reside with me. Oh well...
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
Good point WhiteCo. I just seems like the market is such that there is not alot of negotiation in my part of the country (Seattle area). There are several dealership in my area slapping on Market Adjustment (gouging fees), which I refuse to pay.
 

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Some verbage that I found on the web:

"In order to qualify for any of these savings you must have owned the qualifying vehicle for at least 6 months. The vehicle must currently be registered to someone from your immediate family that resides in your household. You do not have to trade your loyalty vehicle in. You can only use a GM Loyalty Program once for each qualifying GM vehicle"

My Mom owns a Pontiac, but she does not reside with me. Oh well...
Even though you don't have a GM make them give you the credit anyways....the dealer will know how to work around that obstacle....you just have to ask
 

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Good point WhiteCo. I just seems like the market is such that there is not alot of negotiation in my part of the country (Seattle area). There are several dealership in my area slapping on Market Adjustment (gouging fees), which I refuse to pay.

When you tell them you will walk and get a Hyundai...if they need to sell a car then they will make it work...if they are having a good month..they may let you walk...but the way things are with the economy...my hunch is they will make it work :)
 

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I happened to buy my car at the end of the month and my salesman was trying to win a sales contest...he made the deal work :)

You just never know....maybe even try going to a few different dealers...someone will want to give a discount on a cruze to get your business.
 

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You just never know....maybe even try going to a few different dealers...someone will want to give a discount on a cruze to get your business.
I definitely played several dealerships against each other.

How wide are you casting your net? It's worth a couple hour drive to save hundreds of dollars. The '12s will be coming out soon - try to find a dealer w/ several '11s on the lot that need to get rid of them.

You can see dealer inventory online.
 
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