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My Family Has Two 2017 Cruzes with Two Engine Failures...thoughts?
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Is the piston issue something that shows up by a certain mileage? Like for example do most failures happen prior to say, 40K miles, 50, 60? Or have their been many incidents past 60K?
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Seems like most I've seen are inside 30k. Very few have past 60k on a LE2 yet. @UpstateNYBill is getting there with no issues.
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I just passed 60,000 miles somewhere in Georgia on Wednesday. Enjoying Florida weather for a week or so before heading back home. Still no issues to report.
My 2012 gen 1 at 145k had a similar issue, I think? Idled really loud, and poor acceleration. They quoted me to replace all the pistons and rings at almost 2k, so I just traded it in and went with a new 2018 Cruze. Does this sound like a similar issue?
Well, not good news
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Cruze only has a 13 gal tank. Even on dead empty, the difference between 87 and 91/93 is only going to be about 5-6 bucks if that and on an empty tank. I only use Shell gas, which is usually also the most expensive around and it's about 5-6 bucks more to fill up with premium. My 2017 Cruze is the first car that I ever noticed an actual difference in performance/feel using Premium gas. It's definitely more responsive/peppy, more fun to drive. This is also my first turbocharged car, so maybe it's a turbo thing with the premium gas feeling. The only downside is I definitely lose about 2-4 MPG on average with 91 octane vs 87. I'm at 17k miles and keeping my fingers crossed I dodge the piston issue. I baby mine and rarely if ever get on it and the few times I have it wasn't for long. Though my transmission has been wonky as **** since I rolled her off the lot. That's another topic altogether....
During the winter, the gasoline provided have higher Butane, which raises the octane closer to Premium when using 87 Grade. If the temperature is below 50*F, it is extremely difficult to attain 40+mpg. Today here in Maryland, the temperature hit 60*F. I drove 35 Miles on highway speed with the RPM at exactly 2000 and I clocked in at 53mpg
My thoughts... never let a "quicklube" place touch your car, EVER.
Your issues might not be related to anything they did, but best to take them out of the equation. Never found one that does good or reliable work. If you want low-wage/criminal screw-ups working on your vehicle that don't care about anything...go to a quicklube place. It'll be the worst $20+ dollars you've ever spent.
Your issues might not be related to anything they did, but best to take them out of the equation. Never found one that does good or reliable work. If you want low-wage/criminal screw-ups working on your vehicle that don't care about anything...go to a quicklube place. It'll be the worst $20+ dollars you've ever spent.
I wish the bolded part was true where I live. Here the 87 octane is currently averaging 2.559 a gallon, and 91 at most stations is almost a dollar higher per gallon.
Older thread. New here.
But my educated guess is that it is not the oil exactly.
You cannot put a leaned out 4cyl in 1600-1900 RPM with potentially 17psi of boost (highway climbing cruse speed)
And not expect it to eventually get hot and begin acting erratic.
Several other MFGs are also battling this. The tiny boosted engine trend is just its phase.
They want economy and power density at the same time.
Talk to a professional performance engine builder and mention what specs they run with and at and they will say the same things. They are very close to reaching the limit of how economical gasoline can be in a traditional engine.
Next step is either something break-through...or diesel.
I would be willing to bet as the stock tuning is currently on the cars they will all see some failure of this type before 100,000 miles at the MAX.
I mean.. Yeah.. They'll run nice with all that added compression at low speed... But that is tremendous strain and heat being generated.
But my educated guess is that it is not the oil exactly.
You cannot put a leaned out 4cyl in 1600-1900 RPM with potentially 17psi of boost (highway climbing cruse speed)
And not expect it to eventually get hot and begin acting erratic.
Several other MFGs are also battling this. The tiny boosted engine trend is just its phase.
They want economy and power density at the same time.
Talk to a professional performance engine builder and mention what specs they run with and at and they will say the same things. They are very close to reaching the limit of how economical gasoline can be in a traditional engine.
Next step is either something break-through...or diesel.
I would be willing to bet as the stock tuning is currently on the cars they will all see some failure of this type before 100,000 miles at the MAX.
I mean.. Yeah.. They'll run nice with all that added compression at low speed... But that is tremendous strain and heat being generated.
My guess would be MUCH stronger piston design.. Cyl walls or sleeving. Etc. Going to much more expensive material.
You can push the limits of things. But if you need 150psi of air and only have a 120psi tank.. You don't just hope it don't explode. You get the bigger tank to achieve the goals. Lots of variables in it.
But this is my opinion. ?
I'm the test pig. Mine is running in a very custom manner. But not with increased power.
You can push the limits of things. But if you need 150psi of air and only have a 120psi tank.. You don't just hope it don't explode. You get the bigger tank to achieve the goals. Lots of variables in it.
But this is my opinion. ?
I'm the test pig. Mine is running in a very custom manner. But not with increased power.
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Was talking to a GM Tech the other day and we got on the subject of the LE2 engine in the 2nd gen Cruzes. Said he's seeing an alarming amount of issues with piston cracking, just at his dealership alone. Went on to say the common denominator seemed to be people who ran 87 octane gasoline or modded the engine for more output i.e BNR/Trifecta tunes etc.
Curiously I touched on the 87 octane part since the owner's manual states 87 as "recommended". Said it's mainly there for legal reasons, but the small 1.4 Ecotec struggles with pre-detonation on 87, which is resulting in higher chances of piston failures. Makes sense, octane is the resistance gasoline has to detonation, higher octane, higher resistance. He also went on to say that the LE2 suffers from a lack of upper cylinder lubrication by design. Recommended running a group IV full synthetic oil, adding a can of PEA additive for the lubrication and premium gas to mitigate the piston issues as much as possible. Went on to say he's yet to see a failed LE2 who's met most of those.
Since then I immediately started only using 91 octane shell gas and adding gumout multi-system tuneup every few tanks (only 6 bucks on amazon) as it PEA based, unlike Seafoam etc. I'm good on the oil as I've run Amsoil Signature Series in her since I rolled her off the lot, which is surprisingly a Group IV synth and exceeds Dexros across the board. Castrol Edge, Mobil 1 etc are only Group III's. I'm at 17k miles and runs like a top *knocks on wood*. Transmission though, that's another topic entirely.
Hope this helps.
Curiously I touched on the 87 octane part since the owner's manual states 87 as "recommended". Said it's mainly there for legal reasons, but the small 1.4 Ecotec struggles with pre-detonation on 87, which is resulting in higher chances of piston failures. Makes sense, octane is the resistance gasoline has to detonation, higher octane, higher resistance. He also went on to say that the LE2 suffers from a lack of upper cylinder lubrication by design. Recommended running a group IV full synthetic oil, adding a can of PEA additive for the lubrication and premium gas to mitigate the piston issues as much as possible. Went on to say he's yet to see a failed LE2 who's met most of those.
Since then I immediately started only using 91 octane shell gas and adding gumout multi-system tuneup every few tanks (only 6 bucks on amazon) as it PEA based, unlike Seafoam etc. I'm good on the oil as I've run Amsoil Signature Series in her since I rolled her off the lot, which is surprisingly a Group IV synth and exceeds Dexros across the board. Castrol Edge, Mobil 1 etc are only Group III's. I'm at 17k miles and runs like a top *knocks on wood*. Transmission though, that's another topic entirely.
Hope this helps.
If it can't reliably run on 87 without engine damage then Chevrolet is guilty of something, not sure what to call it (false advertising?)
legal reasons my ---, the real reason is if they were truthful with people and said 91 octane was required they wouldn't sell as many economy cars in a market where cost savings is a factor. So it's either spend 4 grand more in gas costs over 100k miles or have to do an engine rebuild? What kind of nonsense is this?
87 has always been the recommendation. With every vehicle I've ever owned. Clear back to leaded gasoline days.
67 Olds being my oldest car and 76 Kawasaki being my oldest bike.
America for the most part has always ran the cheapest stuff. Since the beginning of time. Around here it's 85. Most seem to be selling 87 now, though. Even the news would run a story once in a blue moon that the expensive stuff is just wasted money.
My cruze is the first car I"m actually running 91.
Our cruzes have a compression ratio of 9.5.
My uncle has a 10 Dodge truck. 10.5 compression. His wife's car is a 14 Chev Traverse. 11.5 compression. According to google. Roughly 45k miles on both vehicles. Nothing but the cheapest octane. 85. Owners manual says 87. But their motors aren't turbo either. Bigger then our 85 cubic inches.
67 Olds being my oldest car and 76 Kawasaki being my oldest bike.
America for the most part has always ran the cheapest stuff. Since the beginning of time. Around here it's 85. Most seem to be selling 87 now, though. Even the news would run a story once in a blue moon that the expensive stuff is just wasted money.
My cruze is the first car I"m actually running 91.
Our cruzes have a compression ratio of 9.5.
My uncle has a 10 Dodge truck. 10.5 compression. His wife's car is a 14 Chev Traverse. 11.5 compression. According to google. Roughly 45k miles on both vehicles. Nothing but the cheapest octane. 85. Owners manual says 87. But their motors aren't turbo either. Bigger then our 85 cubic inches.
91/93 is less likely to pre-det. Plus..just better to run on any charged air engine.
I could see the gumout or fuel additive maybe helping some.
They are saying the issue is due to carbon deposits on the intake valves..due to being a DI engine. (Fuel never passes over the valves, only intake air)
So it can build up. Fall into chamber randomly and cause detonation.
Only way to combat the intake valve buildup is from the throttle body or another vac source.
From my research over the past 9 months I've found equally the amount of stock VS tuned cars with the issue. I spoke with two guys with standards.. Asked BNR for most aggressive tune. Adding 6psi to the 17psi base pressure. And hot rodding will do it even faster. They both had piston failures even sooner.
Although a richer A/F is effective at cooling the cyl walls/piston. That is just tons of boost.
From experience tuning older boosted engines.. Boosted cars tend to appreciate running a little rich. It helps with heat and gives it plenty of fuel to accommodate the compressed air.
There are plenty of stock cars having the issues. Seems mostly dependent on being auto or standard. As auto will upshift when it gets under too much load.. And also how the owner drives the vehicle. What loads it stays at.. Etc.
I'm also curious how Amsoil has conducted the testing they claim defeats LSPI. Because there are many other factors going into it than just oil combustion. Climbing a hill @ 16psi @ 1800rpm running lean as it can is the exact ingredients for a disaster.
Makes it even worse that the turbo is so small it can easily spool up to those ranges even in lesser RPM bands.
I could see the gumout or fuel additive maybe helping some.
They are saying the issue is due to carbon deposits on the intake valves..due to being a DI engine. (Fuel never passes over the valves, only intake air)
So it can build up. Fall into chamber randomly and cause detonation.
Only way to combat the intake valve buildup is from the throttle body or another vac source.
From my research over the past 9 months I've found equally the amount of stock VS tuned cars with the issue. I spoke with two guys with standards.. Asked BNR for most aggressive tune. Adding 6psi to the 17psi base pressure. And hot rodding will do it even faster. They both had piston failures even sooner.
Although a richer A/F is effective at cooling the cyl walls/piston. That is just tons of boost.
From experience tuning older boosted engines.. Boosted cars tend to appreciate running a little rich. It helps with heat and gives it plenty of fuel to accommodate the compressed air.
There are plenty of stock cars having the issues. Seems mostly dependent on being auto or standard. As auto will upshift when it gets under too much load.. And also how the owner drives the vehicle. What loads it stays at.. Etc.
I'm also curious how Amsoil has conducted the testing they claim defeats LSPI. Because there are many other factors going into it than just oil combustion. Climbing a hill @ 16psi @ 1800rpm running lean as it can is the exact ingredients for a disaster.
Makes it even worse that the turbo is so small it can easily spool up to those ranges even in lesser RPM bands.
I want to make sure I'm reading this correctly. Are you saying most of the stock unmodified Cruzes having the piston cracking issues are standard shift?
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I personally think (IMHO) “how the owner drives the vehicle” May play a major role in cracking the pistons. I have 2,300 miles on my 2017 LT and have never “WOT” the engine. At best was 1/2 down to pass a bus or get onto the Parkway. I also followed the engine brake-in instructions in the owners manual. I don’t intend to “WOT” unless I have an emergency or I’m being chased by “Godzilla”. I will be visiting the dealership next month for (my first of 2) free oil changes. I will talk directly with the Service Manager (he did invite me to meet with him on my first visit). Let’s see how honest he is. I will report what I’m told.
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