Hey guys first post on here, just picked up my new 2013 Cruze last Monday and loving it so far. Just did the res delete this weekend and looking to buy a K&N drop-in, and do the Intake manifold clearancing. Question is, between the Vermont stage 0 and stage 1, I know that the stage 1 comes complete with the manifold and the tune but I would just assume do the manifold myself, as I've done a fair number of gasket matching/clearancing on previous vehicles without issue. Are there any differences between the actual "tuning" of the stage 0 vs the 1? Meaning would it be possible to achieve the same gains from buying the stage 0 tune and simply porting the manifold yourself? Any information would be appreciated! Thanks!
GMTHNU114
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Hey guys first post on here, just picked up my new 2013 Cruze last Monday and loving it so far. Just did the res delete this weekend and looking to buy a K&N drop-in, and do the Intake manifold clearancing. Question is, between the Vermont stage 0 and stage 1, I know that the stage 1 comes complete with the manifold and the tune but I would just assume do the manifold myself, as I've done a fair number of gasket matching/clearancing on previous vehicles without issue. Are there any differences between the actual "tuning" of the stage 0 vs the 1? Meaning would it be possible to achieve the same gains from buying the stage 0 tune and simply porting the manifold yourself? Any information would be appreciated! Thanks!
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The tune is different. You cannot port the manifold without changing the tune.
The porting changes the volumetric efficiency, and because fueling is based off blended signals from both the MAP and MAF sensors the VE tables need to be adjusted for changes in airflow.
The porting changes the volumetric efficiency, and because fueling is based off blended signals from both the MAP and MAF sensors the VE tables need to be adjusted for changes in airflow.
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From what Brian at V-Tuners told me this isn't really a simple DIY.
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Sorry if this sounds like a dumb question, but then does that mean that you would not be able to order the Vtuner alone and port the manifold yourself? That's what I'm trying to accomplish, I understand that the tune would definitely need to change when the manifold is ported, what I am trying to figure out is if the Vtuner that you purchase at "stage 0" has the capability of adjusting for a ported intake manifold? I only ask because that looks like the only difference between the 0 and 1 is that they throw in a ported manifold. My apologies again if this question is kinda redundant from whats above, just wanted clarification before I go and buy anything. Thanks again for the help!
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No you will need an updated tune after you port your intake I don't know how V-Tuner does there updated tune since I have Trifecta. Hopefully GmMasterTech can pop in.
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Nah, you cant, Hoon explained it well, but the simple thing is your car WON'T start if you port w/o the appropriate Tune.
I spoke often with Brian @ Vermont tuning and we both agree that the Stage 1 w/o Water/Meth injection isnt worth it. You gain about 10hp over the normal Tune...
Better to just use Stage 0 or go up to Water/Meth.
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The tune itself...as in the programming, is different.
You cannot run a ported manifold on the stage 0 tune. The car will not be able to accurately calculate fueling.
You cannot run a stage 1 tune with a stock manifold, as you'll have the same issues.
The problem with buying the stage 1 tune and DIY porting (if they will even sell it separately, which i doubt), is if your port job doesn't exactly match the amount and location of material that VTuner removes, the tune will be inaccurate and the car will run like crap.
If you want to port it yourself, you'll have to tune it yourself also (or have it custom tuned, but beware, rewriting VE tables requires a good deal of tuning knowledge).
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Contact them and ask if its possible to port it yourself. I'm almost positive but don't hold me to it, that a guy bought the stage 1 tune and ported the manifold himself. That's probably your best bet.
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This isn't a small tweak.
It requires a completely different VE table because you're changing the airflow characteristics of the system.
You really need the tuner to know the manifold has been ported so they can adjust accordingly.
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I am sure if your a interested customer Brian will talk to you about it.Its only a email away.I know if i did anything else it would be me porting intake and a water meth kit from Brian.And i would offer to pay him the differance for the tuning.I bet that would be a solid 25 hp increase.
Will do, thanks for the info! Just thinking about it last night I'll likely get the stage zero without the intake porting because as mentioned the car requires the tune for the manifold modifications, but the tune technically voids the warranty, so you wouldn't be able to uninstall/return the tune to stock before taking it into the dealership if the intake was ported. Guess I'll just wait a while to do the intake. I was really looking forward to getting my hands dirty with this car, and the extra power ofcourse!
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Good plan and you will really enjoy the tune.Its a real nice power increase and the hand held is real fast and works great.
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