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The problem with all warranties like that is you have to prove their product caused the damage - read the "fine print"
1. The consumer must provide a written statement or repair order from the dealership or service provider in which the dealership or service provider blames the problem or warranty denial on a K&N product;
2. The service provider or consumer must provide K&N with all allegedly damaged parts. Many states have laws that require a service provider to retain all parts replaced during a vehicle repair, unless given consent to dispose of the parts by the consumer. K&N will pay the shipping cost to recover these parts; and
3. [/COLOR]The consumer must provide proof of purchase of the K&N product along with cooperation in helping us investigate the claim.

I highly doubt you'd ever be able to pull any of that off. How many used ones are for sale where the seller doesn't have the box, and how many of you have receipts that don't turn to plain paper within a few weeks. With those restrictions on the warranty, they'd never have to pony up - and that being the case they could advertise that they've never had a substantiated claim.

Even you state "if you oil correctly..." - even if you do oil correctly, do you think they won't claim you didn't or make you prove you did? Where are your receipts for the oil, prove you cleaned it. Prove you didn't run without a filter for a spell. How far would you be willing to go to try to get them to pony up? The warranty isn't worth anything more than trying to make more sales.


Not trying to start or perpetuate an argument, just expressing my point of view.

OK cool so now that you had you fun do you know how to oil a K&N filter I do. And if you read correctly it states every 50,000 miles on when to oil it what people do is they oil them to early thats how you over oil.

My statement was to not intended to start an argument either but it made you want to pinpoint every little detail out. Now I still habe my K&N on and will probably remove it for a custom designed ram air styled intake but that's in the future.


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Which is bigger than my hand.
 
I also read the K&N warranty (on their site) and came to the conclusion that there are so many hoops to go through to get a warranty claim paid by K&N that it's just not worth the risk.
 
Chrysler is now denying warranty claims when they discover turbo damage...
This is the big one for me - damage to the turbo. The compressor wheels spin so fast that any dust or silt getting through the filter causes an impact that wears the leading edge of the compressor's vanes. Enough wear and structural failure can occur, and when a turbo lets go it can toss metal fragments into the engine...

If what I've read is accurate the Cruze's turbo can exceed 200,000 RPM. Taking a wild a$$ guess that the compressor's inlet diameter is 33mm (should be close), the tip velocity at the inlet is over 1,100 feet per second, or over 760 MPH (approaching the speed of sound). Any particles getting past the filter are sure to do some damage going through that turbo.

As far as the engine goes I'm not sure how much damage these tiny particles can do, but certainly the cleaner the air is the better it will be for engine longevity.
 
Regardless of the procedure necessary, it isn't worth the headache for a 1-2hp increase. It just isn't. There is no point to it when actual warranties have been denied in other engines due to the use of these filters.

I'll stick with my tried and proven dry filters. As far as intakes go, the Injen intake is the only valid option since it uses a very good Amsoil EA filter. Last I checked, the ZZP intake uses a K&N filter.

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While they certainly filter a lot better than K&N, the media *STILL* does not filter as well as a stock AC Delco filter in most cases, and the same warranty claims could be denied.

Paper just filters better than fibers. Period.

K&N Air Filter Review - Debunking the Myths (and why OEM is better)

If you want an intake, it's purely for the sound - which, I'll admit, does sound kinda cool on a turbocharged car.
 
Since I've never owned a turbo engined car, I forgot all about the issues regarding them in this scenario. With this latest K&N, I did notice something when I took it out of the packaging. It was rather slimey. I wrapped the filter in two layers of white paper towels and laid it on a board with some small sandbags to ensure the towels made contact with the filter. Eight days later, the paper toweling was pink all over. Not so much that you could wring them out, but the oil had bled all through them. Even the rubber/vinyl molding was wet with the oil. That's over oiled right out of the box.
 
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260 bucks I saved from not buying this air filter will give me 2,700 miles of driving. If I was lucky enough to get 1 mpg more with this filter, payback would occur after about 120,000 miles of driving. Or at my current rate, about ten years. And at this time, the car wll be a pile of rust with this crazy road salt.

Would be far better off if I could drive 7 mph slower, but still have demands made on me, even though I am suppose to be retired.
 
OK cool so now that you had you fun do you know how to oil a K&N filter I do. And if you read correctly it states every 50,000 miles on when to oil it what people do is they oil them to early thats how you over oil.

My statement was to not intended to start an argument either but it made you want to pinpoint every little detail out. Now I still habe my K&N on and will probably remove it for a custom designed ram air styled intake but that's in the future.


Sent From My Galaxy Note 3.
Which is bigger than my hand.
Sorry, didn't mean to imply YOU didn't know what you were doing, I meant "you" more in a general sense of the term. And I apologize if you're of the impression that I was picking on you; I only copied and pasted the section of their warranty to show the P.T. Barnum/David Hannum-esque nature of those kinds of warranties in general.
 
Oh yea I do t take offense to anything said on forum anymore. I understand that warranting are act here to protect the business from the consumer. But it states specifically that the intervals ti oiling is no were near what people do. But like I stated before it's just some thing to make some noise.
Sent From My Galaxy Note 3.
Which is bigger than my hand.
 
i actually took my K&N out. I much prefer the stock. ill be honest i got it mainly cause i knew the turbo would have a louder sound, but after a while, i got over it and i got tried of people being able to hear the turbo and assume i was ready to race them, AND as if the sound was from a HUGE TURBO. I just did the resonator delete, and put back the stock box.
 
What did my wife and I test drive? Ford, Chrysler, Toyota, Honda, Hyundai, Kia, and Chevy as I recall.

Which car was hands down, the quietest? The Cruze of course, others weren't even close, so why would you want to wreck this key feature?

Ha, you want noise, sure you can download an MP3 somewhere, will have to do a search. Or maybe someone else knows, really don't want noise.
 
What did my wife and I test drive? Ford, Chrysler, Toyota, Honda, Hyundai, Kia, and Chevy as I recall.

Which car was hands down, the quietest? The Cruze of course, others weren't even close, so why would you want to wreck this key feature?

Ha, you want noise, sure you can download an MP3 somewhere, will have to do a search. Or maybe someone else knows, really don't want noise.
LOL even with the ECO, bypass and foam delete is still a faint sound of turbo. My issue wasn't engine noise(seeing that a few of us rely on noise over the tach when shifting) it was more of road and wind noise. I've driven my fair share of uber loud drone prominant exhaust systems to know a full out TBE w/o cats and resonators is not my cup of sweet tea. An intake or just filter as this thread is for would be that small step into the hearing my car perform and feeling like I did something awesome to the seat of my pants catagory.

In short we like more noise where most car owners wnat no noise. Kinda the main reason the Dart Rallye has an exhaust note and we have the sound of moving air from a hidden exhaust tip behind an RS bumper cover.
 
I've read this entire thread and I believe it depends on the engine. I owned a 2006 Trailblazer SS that had a 6.0 LS2 V8 and when I replaced the stock intake with the K&N SRI the difference was obvious as soon as I started the truck. Maybe 4 cyl engines are too weak to utilize the extra airflow it something? Can any of you geardos tell me if that's the reason or why some cars see an increase and others don't?

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I've read this entire thread and I believe it depends on the engine. I owned a 2006 Trailblazer SS that had a 6.0 LS2 V8 and when I replaced the stock intake with the K&N SRI the difference was obvious as soon as I started the truck. Maybe 4 cyl engines are too weak to utilize the extra airflow it something? Can any of you geardos tell me if that's the reason or why some cars see an increase and others don't?

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IF you notice any power gain, it is just because it "tricks" the mass airflow sensor (air passes the sensor element differently), probably causing your truck to run lean.
 
IF you notice any power gain, it is just because it "tricks" the mass airflow sensor (air passes the sensor element differently), probably causing your truck to run lean.
W/o a tune, Subarus tend to run lean as well.


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IF you notice any power gain, it is just because it "tricks" the mass airflow sensor (air passes the sensor element differently), probably causing your truck to run lean.
Many people also remove a very dirty filter when they install a K&N.

Sent from mobile.
 
Can any of you geardos tell me if that's the reason or why some cars see an increase and others don't?
Every car is different, but they will all see small power gains by replacing the OEM filters with less restrictive aftermarket ones. The question is, are the gains worth it?

Also, we need to consider two different modifications, one being a simple filter swap and the intake being a replacement for the entire intake airway.

A simple filter swap will eliminate much of the restriction caused by the stock filter. A filter swap is usually good for about 5-10 hp on a big v8, or roughly a 1-2% power increase. Not much, and when you scale that down to a small 4 cylinder car you're likely talking 1-3 hp which is insignificant and not even possible to validate with a dyno since run-to-run variations usually vary by more than that. Statistically it's "noise".

Changing an intake can make larger gains than a simple filter swap because the restriction in the factory piping (which often includes noise reducing baffles/chambers etc.) is eliminated. It's not uncommon to see 20 hp gains on large engines, but again that is only working out to gains in the 5% arena which works out to 6-8 hp on small engines.

Complicating things are the claims made by intake manufacturers, many of whom will take the worst dyno run before the intake and the best one after and then publish the "peak" power difference between the two. Others will tune the car in addition to adding their intake and then claim gains "up to" a certain amount. As a general rule I usually take a manufacturer's claimed power improvement and divide by 2.

Any air intake also stands to corrupt the air flow through the Mass Air Flow sensor and cause variations in air/fuel ratios in open loop operation (WOT). This may even be done on purpose by the intake manufacturer since leaning out the A/F ratio of an engine tends to increase power. In the case of the intake actually replacing part of the MAF sensor, the intake may or may not have the same flow characteristics and/or cross sectional area of the OEM MAF sensor whether intentional or not.

The main thing to consider with intakes is that they provide power increases by reducing restriction to airflow, which by definition means that they have their greatest effect at the engine's maximum power level and taper off very quickly before that. If your engine makes peak power at 6000 RPM, the effect of the intake is mostly lost below 4500-5000 RPM. So you're paying for a small increase in airflow which only benefits the engine at the uppermost limit of its operating speed. Unless you're racing and looking for that last 10th of a second, it doesn't make too much difference.

Most of the low hanging fruit has long been picked as far as simple power increases are concerned. OEMs are under immense pressure to put advertising numbers up so their cars look better than the competition. The good ol' days of 20 hp intake and exhaust system upgrades are pretty much behind us, and the OEM equipment is generally very well designed and doesn't leave a whole lot on the table.
And the last point is filtration efficiency. As I stated earlier, there is not much public knowledge of how much potential damage can be caused by allowing "dirty" air into an engine as far as damage inside the combustion chamber goes, but there IS evidence that it can cause significant damage to the high speed parts of a turbocharger.

Being a little older and wiser than I once was, I'm no longer chasing every last single hp from my 4 cylinder daily driver… in fact with my Cruze I'm quite happy so far just leaving the engine stock (minus a spark plug upgrade for drivability improvements). The fact the Cruze has a turbocharger is one reason I will not likely "upgrade" the air filter to a free flowing unit. However my other car, a high mileage 2002 ZO6 Corvette, has been wearing an oiled wire/gauze air filter since I bought it in 2004. Two years ago I pulled the heads to install a new cam and lifters and the heads were in terrific condition; intake valve seats were like new and the valve guides were still nice and tight. I lapped the exhaust valve seats (they had some mild pitting) and they were ready to bolt back on. The cylinder bores still show the original machining marks and the engine uses no oil to speak of. It had ~110,000 miles on it at the time and is now over 120,000 miles.
 
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